Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ

I certainly look forward to Jeremy interviewing Sir Stuart Rose ;o) and certainly in the light of the article below:



I'm very happy to see that Tim will be uncovering the truth about Kaminski, as there are so many conflicting reports about him. Also looking forward to Susan's report on climate change too.

Monday's looking better already.....

Part of my training is in geology, the only fact I am sure about concerning climate change is that it has been happening as a natural process ever since we had a climate on this planet!!

Remember the ice age anyone..?

Be it from slight changes in the earths rotational axis, slight changes in the suns output energy or phenomenon like large volcanic eruptions, the Co2 levels and average world temperatures and sea levels along with it change all the time, all of which is outside mans control and always will be!!!

Who is to say that the extra co2 in the atmosphere now will now protect us from getting too cold due to some other factor over which we have no control like a period of historic low volcanic eruptions or entering a period where solar activity is slightly reduced?

Sea levels (in geological time) have been going up and down like a whores draws ever since records began and human beings have adapted to these natural changes.

In our technological arrogance do we really think that we are the only ones who influenence climate?

Have we forgotten the story of king Canute?

The truth is I fully support the push to use less fossil fuels, not becuase of climate change but because of the simple fact that we can not rely on something which is not renewable because ...derrrrrr...we will run out of it! We will then probably end up fighting and murdering each other to control what is left when it starts to become scarce (Iraq was not about oil of course........).

I also want to see fossil fuel use rolled back because I dont like the idea of pollution in our beautiful planet, not just co2, but all the other pollution nasties which come with it along with including corruption / war human misery etc.

Why dont we simply do it on the basis as described above?

Is that no reason enough for goodness sake?

Why do we have to do it on the premise of 'climate change' and go to great lengths to pursuade ourselves we can change something ...that changes unpredictably anyway without any input from us!!.

The climate will always change guys no matter what we do..GET OVER IT!!!

It is no surprise to me at all that the hackers have found evidence of massaging the data by leading climate change research bodies.

Does anyone else remember the Y2K computer meltdown predictions? Didn't a lot of people make a career and a lot of money out of that scam?

Its odd, as far reducing our dependence on fossil fuels go we are trying to do the right thing...but for all the wrong reasons!

I dont know why I bother, nobody ever listens anyway, I should spend my lunchtime eating my sandwiches like everyone else.

What a load of nonsence and awaste of money and human ex[pertise that could be directed elsewhere.


Jericoa

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

More Beeb Tory bashing, no surprise there. And I'm sure that you will do your best to prop up the stupid global warming theory despite the computer hackers proving that is just a big scam.

#2 Jericoa

1)Pretty much what I think

2) As regards the hacking, doen't surprise me. When we set up the new generation of climate models, not that I have to agree with the findings, my email was part of the mailing list.

I got fed up with the viruses the AV had to stop coming from people in academia were spamming out. Too much time on their hands and too much access to computers.

Had to contact the web masters of the institutions and then send them back the emails so they could stop the source.

Ha ha, so the " Corporate Nazi " university eco-fascist high priests have been caught out on their neat little grammar school boy scam. Perhaps Susan Watts will attempt to whitewash over the whole leaked e-mail victory for the probable truth and trot out what nasty people these computer hackers are. It looks like the Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ are doing their level best to keep the CRU Climate Gate hacking story off the Muppet news. Good job they had big floods in Cumbria to attempt to blame on climate change even though allegedly almost just as much rain once fell in a summer thunderstorm in Dorset in 1955.

Reminds me of this.

Back in about 1980 I was mates with a particularly bright ex-grammar school lad who shared a common interest in railways and stuff like Iron Maiden. We used to visit the local signal box frequently and apart from the regular through freight trains had the complication of a junction leading into the cement works sidings. There was a cement train in and out every evening weekdays, light in summer at least when it performed. We used to spend hours " camping " one shift signalman, who was only about 24 at the time and also into railway modeling.

My mate had set his heart on owning a Bardick lamp, BR issue electric torch also with three colour signal potential. It could also be used as an emergency tail light on a train so the plan was to steal one, couldn't be bought anywhere at any price. It all relied on the cooperation of aforementioned signalman, the only potential eye witness.

The plan was to steal the oil tail-light from the train about to depart the cement sidings, I can't recall the exact train of events but the whole object of the exercise was to force the guard to use his Bardick as the tail lamp, then steal it off the train waiting to depart standing on the wrong main line. It all went to plan even though it involved actions half a mile apart ( car essential ), at no time were the public put at risk, the signalman reporting the missing tail light to the next signal box. You could bet that by the time he found out his Bardic was missing ( and how could you loose up to three ( including spares ) BR standard oil tail lamp ) he was scratching his head about doing the explaining when he got home.

..an anti-Semite and a neo-Nazi ..

some jews and those who support human rights for all get called that by israeli right wingers too. because of the blanket name calling these terms are now meaningless throw away ejaculations. wasn't sharon called a nazi?

She'll be asking if we can trust the scientists.

The scientists, yes.



I am sure that, here in the UK, we have better standards. If perhaps at least two. Which can often mean one too many.

Remember, from now on the watchword is watertight oversight, which I presume includes stuff like balance, objectivity & consistency, right?

/blogs/thereporters/richardblack/

Update 2309: Because comments were posted quoting excerpts apparently from the hacked Climate Research Unit e-mails, and because there are potential legal issues connected with publishing this material, we have temporarily removed all comments until we can ensure that watertight oversight is in place.

Update 2 - 0930 GMT Monday 23 November: We have now re-opened comments on this post. However, legal considerations mean that we will not publish comments quoting from e-mails purporting to be those stolen from the University of East Anglia, nor comments linking to other sites quoting from that material.

A high standard has been set. It will be interesting to see if, or when that might change, thanks to the unique ways events can find themselves interpreted when the mood takes.

Why has this been down played in the media - its significant !



Hope your keeping yourself warm Mim .

#10

Trying to, Streetphotobeing, the heater's on

mim

Stewpot, I'm certain, is not the only boss who takes his customers for schmucks; and what is the point of asking the CBI how to get us out of the Grand Schemozzle; it's like asking a firm of undertakers to find a cure for death.

Why would business leaders, whose share options, LTIPs, salaries and potential knighthoods and lordships depend entirely on "growth" have the slightest inclination for a balanced economy?

They're all busy inflating the next bubble; have you seen commodity prices, the price of commercial property, the house price index recently?
A combination of QE, low asset values in UK and lack of housing is pumping up the lilo, while the CEOs see the FTSE steadily rise.

Meanwhile, what is going on exactly in Cumbria? Why will it take "weeks" to produce temporary bridges for these wretched souls? Will the local councils really be asked to foot the bill for the repairs to their antiquated regional infrastructure?

How far will Gordi's million pound giveaway go?

We need to realize quick that we live in a Third World country masquerading as a world leader - only because we allow it to be so.

Sort it at the General Election next year with a hung Parliament that needs to work together to get things done.

And bring some of the REME back from Afghanistan to build them some bridges in Cumbria; much more vital work.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

#14 continuation

I suppose I should have mentioned the possibility of 'scientists' who are not scientists at all but ordinary impostors!

mim

If you don't let these posts through, Moderators, I'm going to write to Sir Michael Lyons again as well as to Media Complaints Commission, whatever their name is.

Madam Mim

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Considering the background, I was surprised that the report on Kaminski contained so many serious vague and unsubstantiated allegations. It was really a second rate and tendentious piece of journalism.

Re: the removed posts at #3 & #14, and a few other ones recently deleted from the NN blogging space.

As promised at #17, I shall deal with the issue in the next few days. I'm too tired at the moment and tomorrow morning I need to get on with life early so won't have the time to carefully phrase my point to after all some of the highest authorities of the land.

Madam Mim

P.S. I'm in possession of all the deleted posts anyway.

Those evil tories getting into bed with that nasty Kaminski man, if they win the general election they'll probably invite him to number 10 for tea and biscuits. Oh wait, Tony Blair already did that back in 2005.



Don't you just love New Labours double standards?

Re: Climate Change Feature.

Unfortunately, Bob Watson was able to get away with describing the 'trick' as a mathematical technique to get around a complex problem. It was no such thing. It was a deliberate manipulation of 2 separate data sources in order to make the present appear much warmer than the past (including the Medieval Warm Period).

I'll give Bob Watson the benefit of the doubt. I just don't think he's qualified to discuss the issue. Unfortunately the interviewers are likely to be even less qualified.

Outstanding Newsnight tonight - from Jeremy's debate with Professors Singer & Watson on the leaked climate change e-mails (an investigation into the leaked e-mails would be the best solution, then there would be proof either way) to the eagerly awaited interview with Sir Stuart Rose :o)
You know what, Jeremy was right - Sir Stuart Rose may well end up following in the footsteps of Lord Alan Sugar! He was the only person to discuss the economic downturn and how it could be realistically tackled - something we have not really been told about.
Interesting report by Tim on Kaminski. The Chief Rabbi of Poland, Michael Schudrich, dismissed the allegations of Kaminski being an Anti-Semite. According to An excellent debate by Jeremy with MacShane & Hannan on the follow-up to Tim's report which cleared up the entire matter once and for all.

Oh and the article in the Jewish Chronicle

referred to in the interview also agreed with the conclusions of the debate.

Newsnight solves it all :o)
(I wonder what it would be like if Newsnight became the Government with Jeremy as PM.......just a thought....)

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

@Gaylord #21 - OMG what utter hypocrites!!!!!!

#23

Mistress76uk

What would Jeremy want to be the PM for? To get bogged down in helpless squabbles, to be responsible for sending young people to inevitable military conflicts that may het happen?


I can't speak for him, obviously, but somehow can't imagine him wanting to take that up and personally think he is best placed where he is now, working as a journalist and writing books. One never knows, the Queen might one day promote him to the House of Lords from where he could speak his mind up as well.

Madam Mim

#23 continuation

Mistress76uk

I just wanted to add that the best bits of tonight's programme were:

Sir Stuart Rose talking in the studio and not the bit when he was talking about some medications. That bit was incomprehensible to me.

Mr MacShane defending British Politics as against politics manipulated by creeps.

Madam Mim

#27

I forgot to mention Mr Singer's contribution to the programme. I thought it was very good as well.

Madam Mim

@ Mim #26 - Jeremy would make a fantastic PM :o)
Not only would he be talking sense on the country, he wouldn't take any nonsense from any of his political colleagues either, and he'd be completely transparent. Just perfect.

#29

It may be so but I can't see him wanting to do that

mim

The trick of putting a controversial 85 year old man in the open air to represent the opposition at the end of November didn't work very well, did it ? Singer completely outclassed both Watson and Paxman and it was very obvious Paxman was desperately trying to help Watson tell his 'story'.

Cheap.

Kaminski piece was a shocking piece of tabloid journalism followed up with that labour goon spouting the usual rubbish. Expected better from the bbc.

#31

What makes you think, 'dude', that Paxo was 'desperately' trying to help Watsiit? I thought he was even handed. As for myself, 'dude', sitting in my armchair I felt absolutely livid with Watsit /who was wearing a 'duck' tie/ but as I was in a humourous, 'mocky' mood, I couldn't help but poke fun at Watsit, as well as Daniel as a matter of fact.

But, as I was only at home, and not in the studio facing Watsit face to face I thought it was safe for me to behave the way I felt. But I promise you this, even if I had been in the studio, I may not have used similar poking fun tactics, but would definitely have launched a straight and forward opposition to what they were saying and to what they were up to but as in real life I act with spontaneity I can't be precise what exactly I would have said and with what tone. I imagine I would have 'behaved' with a degree of dignity and respect unless the Watsits kept pushing me to the limits of acceptibility on their part.

'nuff said? capice?

Madam Mim

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Neat post kashibeyaz #13 couldn't of portrayed the current situation better myself.

Nobody wants to stop the " Corporate Nazi " financial and therefore environmental rape of our planet more than me ! AGW is just a convenient excuse to extort tax from the relatively poor whilst the rich bastards who do most of the " polluting " escape any real " green tax " which could make some real downward impact on emissions, like raising the top rate of income tax to 75%.

Perhaps hardly surprising the Jeremy skirted around the the many refused Freedom of Information requests to the CRU. The ten bob fat cat high rate tax paying jet set brigade will do anything they can to avoid paying their fair share of the tax burden to fund the current welfare state for the banks and their stock market parasites.

The point must be that nobody can trust any government funded body on anything science related since the politicians got caught with their filthy fingers in the till. Absolutely no chance of getting an impartial in depth inquiry into the validity of the science given that climate science is now a quasi-religion.

Clever piece of propaganda with the man with the light and dark shells on the beach, even though he apparently admits that the scientists do not fully understand our weather systems. A pretty simple analysis of the UK weather is that if wind is in the south to west it will be a warm summer or winter, cold if the wind is in the north to east and fully dependent on the strength of the energy being emitted by the sun to drive said winds a varying speeds.

Perhaps intimidation of the skeptic witness Bob Singer, shining the lights in his eyes so that he is forced to close them. " can you hear me " says Jeremy, stood in a dark street with a squawking loud hailer pointing at you as well as the lights, a mate of mine once did it and found it very difficult. However, pre scripted daylight interview for Bob Watson, then another stage managed relaxed studio situation. We have nothing to fear as American data confirms our figures say's Bob Watson.

Another news report for Barrie's collection, this time Sky News.

This time an interview with the mothers of the service men killed in Iraq who brought the legal action the war was illegal.

They did it on a main road at rush hour with workmen behind them digging up the road with a pneumatic drill.

#34 update

As my post at #34 has been deleted, I have sent it off directly to the Whitehouse for the attention of the President himself.

But for now, I've come up with a ditty dealing with some of today's events:

24 November

It’s just about six on the 24th.
Have now had my bath
And it is well past seven.
I’ll twirl to Cohen at eleven.

What I shall skate to before and after
Is still a question of matter
Of time. Whatever it is will hopefully be fine.

mim

Many comments removed yesterday. Mine was on the global warming fiddle. I expect a few of the others were as well. Why do we have to suffer this level of censorship on the Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ which we are forced to pay for on pain of prison? Typical of the overbearing nature of all State institutions in this country at ther moment. The Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ should be a beacon of free speech, not the Pravda-like voice of the State it has become.

Newsnight deserves some credit for actually covering the horrendous revelations in these leaked global warming emails. The sceptics Singer and Lawson were at least allowed to finish a sentence, which has not always been the case in previous Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ programmes. But poor Fred Singer had clearly not even been briefed about what the question was - he started talking about the general global warming issue and didn't realise it was about the emails until later.
The attempt by Watson to explain away 'trick' and 'hide the decline' as mathematical language was just disgusting.
I am not sure what I can say here without getting moderated out so I won't risk going any further.

Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ WRONG FOCUS - AS USUAL

We had discussion of 'The Tony Deception' on the 'Today Program'. But never a glance at the man himself. Surely it does not take any specialist skill to know Blair's motivation in life? Hello? Megalomania is too small a word. Did not Harold Shipman tell all we needed to know, through silence, AFTER he 'left' doctoring?

As far as Tony is concerned, Chilcot will be his 'finest hour' when he is 'proved' whiter than white and purer than pure - Emperor of the World, in the finest New Clothes you never saw.

Now we have Brown - look hard at THE MAN. Then we will get another of the same ilk UNLESS WE LEARN TO LOOK AT THESE WANNABES, THE WAY WE DID AT FIVE - IN THE PLAYGROUND.

Nos 37 - Mim

The feeling comes that the loved one may find concern for madam mim's mind over heating in The White House and the serious implications for world peace as a result.

He hopes cool thoughts twirl and slide in a logical and normal fashion, like the laws of physics with style, grace and a touch of rum on the side so world order disaster can be averted.

41

Well, Streetphotobeing, I'll just have to twirl the way I feel the music. That's one of the laws of my creativity. But at the endof each 'creation', if I may call my twirls like that I shall be composed and dignified.

Shall be in touch later

mim

I saw a newsclip of the members of the Chilcot Inquiry yesterday and if anyone thinks this crew will blow the gaffe on Phony Tony et al - the mind boggles.

"We have a problem; the peasants want to know what's going on, but of course we're not going to tell them; would you like to be part of this, plus expenses? Last for at least a year, so no worries there about how you'll fill your next 12 months."

And whatever Double Decker Chilcot comes up with, well, we all know the truth about Iraq and Afghanistan anyway.

Polish Kaminski is an opportunist like most politicians; in this country, immigration pulls the populist levers, in Poland, anti- Jewish sentiment.

I thought the Today Programme, some weeks ago, had effectively killed the notion that Kaminsky is anti-semitic with its interview with the Chief Rabbi of Poland.
Furthermore, juxtaposing inserts about 1940s atrocities and comments about Kaminsky and the Tory Party was scurrilous in the extreme.I have always staunchly defended the Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ but this and similar reporting is making me increasingly convinced that it does not have a future.

#43

Ah, Kashibeyaz, not quite. The Polish PO party with Donald Tusk at it's head, despite the recession, althoughst pobably the mildest in the world, and the fact they've been in power for approximately two years, I think, is well ahead in the polls and they are definitely not identifiable by antisemitim.

mim

Climate clangers

a culture of jurrasic park busted open?
will susan next be giving a report that carbon trading is the 'only' solution?

Fit for the Party of Churchill?

"The Bedouins in the Negev are thirsty for water and recognition" and "The State and JNF are land thieves".

The State, through the JNF, is doing everything it can to conspire against the Bedouins and take over their lands in a brutal manner..



cameron [and brown and blair] are patrons of the jnf. apparently its not rcist? and further not worth investigating how their patronage squares with human rights for all?

also 1 million people in the uk voted for the bnp. are they all racists?

if jewish communists helped deport people why is stating that fact unacceptable or anti semitic?

what has krystalnacht got to do with warsaw? it just looked a stunt?

as for the Poles which Allied country refused to have them in their WW2 victory parade? was that racist? what did churchill say about that?

again should we not be concerned at what our politicians patronage and if they are pro human rights or not?

as for milliband's name coming up again in another foreign office blunder maybe its one time too many?

why would the iraq inquiry need to offer 'no prosecution' deals?

THEY DON'T LIKE IT UP 'EM (#43)

"I saw a newsclip of the members of the Chilcot Inquiry yesterday and if anyone thinks this crew will blow the gaffe on Phony Tony et al - the mind boggles."

In the same way, schools with useless members of staff, ease them out quietlly, for the 'good name of the school'. Britain will not want to acknowledge that we elevate delusional nutters to PM, even if Brown IS a one-man motorway-hoarding to that effect.

Chilcot/Iraq IN Quiry ? every inquiry we have had since nulab has been A whitwash and complete and utter waste of money.

will things change with Chicot? I do hope so. I wont be holding my breath or My Cheeks 2gether, not yet.

Ready to Dump? allways.

Jericoa #2

Excellent piece! Every nail hit squarely on its head. And yet how few will read it. On the Newsnight blog, nobody can hear you scream.

Now, just for the masochistic fun of it, let's look into who is perpetuating this ludicrous state of affairs.

Can someone explain please why Iran needs long range missiles as transport for its 'peaceful' nuclear programme?

I have to admit i'm most interested in finding out what the so-called experts think will bring the uk out of recession, quicker. And how it will affect ME!!! The Conservatives have practically promised to push my car for me the next time i run out of petrol miles from a service station. so i don't think they'll be saying anything practical at all. Digby ( i'm loaded) Jones, probably will want to scrap the 50% tax rise and place it firmly down there where the poorest members of society can share the burden. And Gordon Brown will just spend more so, that if the conservatives win, we will feel some effect of their cuts.
In all honesty, I'd like to see the Liberals get their act together, so we can all vote Lib dem, so the smarmy (if it aint me, it's gonna be you)gits have something to think about.

jauntycyclist

I tap you on the shoulder with a rolled up copy of the Newsnight blog and claim my Β£5. YOU are bookhimdano!

#54 New Fazer

One of his first posts under his new ID within the witness protection programme was about feed in tariffs. Blew his cover straight away.

53
yes. i said at the time the new login wouldn't accept the old id so i changed it. no secret.

Re: Susan Watts' report:

1 - The shell example - possibly a great illustration, though probably not as intended.
A chap sets out a number of white (warm year) and black (cool year) shells, then shows if you take some black shells away then the white shells will eventually outnumber the black shells. Hilarious!

Why not have two boxes, each containing white and black shells in the proportion represented by the theories of the two camps. Then blindly take ten shells out of each. Which box produces the closer match to what we have actually experienced over the last ten years? Excuses can be made, of course, but then make Watts & Prof Palmer bet a years salary on which box is most accurate for the next year, or the next five years. Seems unfair, perhaps? Well how does that compare to betting trillions on an unproven theory?

Which leads to
2 - How can a claim be made that computer modelling and the majority of scientists support the theory of global warming when the material that has surfaced from UEA CRU shows a questionable (at least) approach to modelling data, and also shows tampering with the processes of peer review and publishing papers?

3 - Finally, I'm surprised that the proposition of criminally breaking the FOIA (the frankly anti-scientific approach of destroying data rather than reveal it) is covered by "it is not hard to dip into emails and select excerpts to look like a conspiracy".