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	TX: 13.10.03 â€“ DISABILITY CAMPAIGNERS CALL ON SHOPS TO PROVIDE SIGNERS AND GUIDERS TO DEAF AND BLIND CUSTOMERS

	PRESENTER: WINIFRED ROBINSON ROBINSON For the last three years Manchester's Trafford Centre has been making shopping easier for people with sensory impairments by providing sign language interpreters and guiders whenever they're needed. Sensory Solutions was the first service of its kind in the UK but it was funded by charities who say they can't afford to continue with it. The RNID, the main charity involved, now wants the stores and shopping centres to take over the costs. We went to the Trafford Centre to find out how Sensory Solutions worked and we spoke to Ann Waghorn, who's visually impaired. WAGHORN Shopping really when you can't see, full stop, is a nightmare, it really is. And if you really - a lot of blind people rely on family because they're just inaccessible. And they have things like Shopmobility but that's mainly for people with wheelchairs. Most people aren't used to blind people. THOMAS My name's AnnThomas, I'm an access officer at the Trafford Centre, which basically means I guide visually impaired, blind people and also communications support for deaf people. We're just coming to Boots and we're just going to go over to the lift and go up in the lift. WAGHORN And we're going to go upstairs and I'm going to buy some â€¦ THOMAS The whole of the ElizabethArden range. WAGHORN I like perfume, I love perfume. Now no one is going to come off a Boots counter to show me the different perfumes and smells but with a guider they're trained to do it, they just do it for me. And then I'll decide what perfume I want and if I'm paying by my card the guider will find the card for me and help me to sign it and sort it out. And you can't do that without sighted help like that. THOMAS Right they've got some perfumes in gift boxes, small ones - there's Red Door, Fifth Avenue â€¦ WAGHORN I'm not keen on Red Door. THOMAS Are you not? I like that one. WAGHORN It's a big sweet. THOMAS It's rather like being a commentator on the radio with a football match. She doesn't need me to talk for her, she'll do all that, I just guide her to the shops that she wants to go to. Explain what's available, what I can see, and just talk her through everything that I can actually see. WAGHORN Quite recently I decided to throw all my clothes out and buy new. So I came here and we went to the - round the fashion shops and I got three lovely dresses and everybody says how nice they are and that was due to Karen's help. I couldn't have done that myself. I mean yes they will help you in store but it's somebody you don't know and you can't trust them as well. But I've known these girls since this Sensory Solutions started and I know that they will give me good advice. THOMAS That's nice that. WAGHORN Yeah. What do you think of that? Yes I'm going to try that for a change. What do you get in the gift set? SHOP ASSISTANT The gift set's better value. WAGHORN The joy of coming here is you don't have to book a guider in advance, you can just decide - I want to go shopping, I want to go to the Trafford Centre and just get on the bus and I can ring them on the bus and say I'm on my way, I'll be at the bus station in 10 minutes and there'll be somebody there to meet me. And that's the joy and I will miss that, I must be honest. ROBINSON Ann Waghorn. Well I'm joined now by RussellHamblin-Boone, he's from the British Retail Consortium, and by SharonCollins, who's director of services at the RNID. Sharon Collins, Sensory Solutions at the Trafford Centre, how much did it cost the charities, it's been going for three years? COLLINS Basically it cost a hundred thousand pounds a year to run Sensory Solutions. That's â€¦ ROBINSON Employing how many people? COLLINS Four currently, but it was six originally. And the idea was that it's open seven days a week, 10 till 11, 363 days a year, as the Trafford Centre is. So people with sensory impairment can have the same access to shopping when they want to, like everybody else. ROBINSON Now I said you can no longer afford to fund it, when are you going to stop? COLLINS We have stopped. Sensory Solutions is now closed. That's partly due to the coincidence of the Festival Village, where we're located, being refurbished and if we were going to have to close down for that it was a good time to stop the pilot, the pilot's been running for three years. ROBINSON Russell Hamblin-Boone what happens in most shops now if you have sensory impairment and you want to shop? HAMBLIN-BOONE Most customer service centres and retail staff are trained in looking after visually impaired and deaf people. There are a number of training courses and things in place and for us this isn't an issue of disability, this is an issue of customer service. ROBINSON But what do you have to do then if you want to go to the shop of your choice, you're saying most of the staff are trained? HAMBLIN-BOONE I mean currently, depending on the circumstances of course, there are cases where you would need to telephone in advance, make an appointment, and that is something that we would hope to be improved upon with schemes like Sensory Service. ROBINSON Sharon wants companies and shopping malls to take it over, will they do that? HAMBLIN-BOONE Well I hope that they'll look at what's happened at the Trafford Centre. Retailers are constantly improving the customer services that they provide. ROBINSON But short answer no? HAMBLIN-BOONE The short answer is that this is - will be part of an ongoing project, hopefully there'll be some things taken from this scheme that can be used in other town centres. Retailers will have a responsibility come October next year, under the Disability Discrimination Act, to put in place better measures for their customers and this is perhaps something that they can be considering. ROBINSON Sharon Collins what would be the business benefits for a company? I mean why on earth should the Trafford Centre want to spend Â£300,000 on something like that? COLLINS I think the interesting thing is that over the time we've helped about 9,000 people in depth to go shopping. The interesting thing about Russell's comments is yes perhaps when you get into the store someone is there to help you, they're also there to sell you something and impartial advice isn't necessarily what you get. You've also got to arrive â€¦ ROBINSON I mean human nature - human nature's a bit better than that isn't it? COLLINS I would hope so but you've also got to arrive at somewhere like the Trafford Centre, if you're blind you have to get from one end of it to another in order to get to somebody who's trained to get that advice. Walking around the Trafford Centre with all those people milling around, how do you know what's in the window, how do you go window shopping before you decide to buy? And I think the interesting thing about this is we've provided about 80,000 people with information, which then leads them to go and make purchases and if it costs Â£100,000 a year and there's 200 retailers in the Trafford Centre, half of them are large, half of them are medium sized or small, you're talking about an annual cost of 750 for the large ones and 250 a year for small ones, this is not a large amount of money on an annual subscription basis. ROBINSON Russell Hamblin-Boone just let's get this straight though, in the Trafford Centre at least this project is finished now, it is a dead duck? HAMBLIN-BOONE Well that remains to be seen. The Trafford Centre may be the pioneer that leads the way for other schemes in other centres. In the British Retail Consortium, for example, we're promoting to our members a high street charter, which is something we're working on with the Guide Dogs for the Blind. ROBINSON Russell Hamblin-Boone, Sharon Collins thank you both. Back to the Transcripts homepage Back to the You and Yours homepage The Âé¶¹Ô¼ÅÄ is not responsible for external websites

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