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IN TOUCH – University Special

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TX:Ìý 29.09.20Ìý 2040-2100

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PRESENTER:Ìý ÌýÌýÌýÌýÌýÌýÌý PETER WHITE

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PRODUCER:Ìý ÌýÌýÌýÌýÌýÌýÌýÌýÌý MIKE YOUNG

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White

Good evening.Ìý The start of this new university year is proving to be concerning and confusing enough for any student, the questions keep coming, don’t they?Ìý It started with where’s my timetable, how much tuition will be online and how much face-to-face, am I going to get my money’s worth from this course and now, of course, dominating the news over the past few days, will I be safe and can I have the good time university is supposed to provide without endangering anyone else, not to mention will I be able to go home for Christmas.

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Well, we’ve already seen concerning spikes, of course, of covid in a number of universities, notably Glasgow and Manchester, there have been others and there may well be more.Ìý We certainly can’t ignore those issues but our main concern on tonight’s programme is what about the blind and partially sighted students starting out at uni for the first time or picking up their studies which were so rudely interrupted back in March.Ìý We’re going to concentrate on their hopes, their fears, their coping tips to each other and some advice from those who are in a position to know a few answers as well.

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Jimmy Bryden is from the Isle of Man and he seems to have been pretty well prepared.Ìý He’s starting to read maths at Birmingham University and he came to Birmingham a fortnight ago, a week before virtual freshers’ week.Ìý

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Jimmy, first of all, tell us about your preparations – why so early?

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Bryden

I wasn’t sure about mobility, so my grandma thought she’d come with me and do some mobility with me.Ìý We came a bit early so that she had a few days to be here and help me get settled in.

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White

So, presumably, you were expecting or hoping that somebody would be able to give you a bit of mobility training to get around the place?

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Bryden

Yeah.

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White

What happened about that, how long did it take?

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Bryden

It didn’t happen when I thought it was going to happen, it started about halfway through freshers’ week in a minor way but obviously timetabling mobility slots – as you mentioned timetables were a nightmare, it’s happening very slowly.

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White

Okay, well we’ll come on to timetabling but just give me an idea, how difficult has the orientation been because my own memory of first impressions, many years ago, is of campuses with great big open spaces, buildings widely spread, hazards like fountains, how are you doing, how have you confronted it?

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Bryden

There’s quite a lot of shared area and all the maintenance vehicles are electric vans, so they’re deadly silent.Ìý I’ve no idea where I’m going, so I’m quite happy that I don’t have to be anywhere in the near future because it’s optional online because I’ve no idea where I’m going.

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White

Right.Ìý And the other thing I have to ask you at the moment, you’re in a hall of residence, I think, and they, of course, have been featured as places where covid could easily spread if the right precautions aren’t taken.Ìý What’s been your experience and how concerned are people?

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Bryden

There’s mixed concern between people.Ìý There are people who are just trying to keep themselves to themselves and then there are people who don’t seem to be particularly concerned.

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White

And yourself, how do you feel?

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Bryden

I’m just trying to follow the rules and stay sort of safe whilst still trying to make as many friends as possible.

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White

Right, we’ll come on to that.Ìý We’ll be hearing plenty more from Jimmy but we’re also joined by Carys Whitehall.Ìý Now Carys, you’d expected to be starting your second year reading English Literature at the University of Chichester, that isn’t happening now, just explain why not.

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Whitehall

I decided I kind of wanted, if I was going to go back for my second year, I wanted it to be a fresh start and to take everything in my stride but that can’t happen with covid because, you know, you have to social distance and stick to the rule of six.Ìý I also had a bit of an epiphany over the lockdown period and decided that after I’ve taken my intermission, I’m returning next September but I’m going to have a course change and change to vocal teaching or vocal performance, I’m not sure what yet.

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White

Right, can I bring you back to this worry about social distancing because I think, you know, that was clearly a big factor – the prospect of all this.Ìý Why did it worry you so much?

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Whitehall

I feel that being visually impaired a lot of your communication with people is through touch or speech.Ìý Obviously, that can’t always take place when you’re two metres apart from people because you’re not – say social cues – you’re not reading them as well if you’re not near to people, especially if people are wearing masks – the voices can kind of be quite muffled – so if you’re trying to make friends with people or interact or ask for help you might interpret what someone’s saying, their tone of voice, slightly differently.Ìý Also, I have a sighted guide in place because every semester they decide to change where you have your lectures, so you might learn the route to a specific set of rooms and I can walk that with my sighted guide beside me but then the next time round, next semester, I know that the rooms will change so I’d say oh can I grab someone’s arm, that’s not a possibility with covid unfortunately.

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White

So, I mean, you basically thought that this would get in the way of the way in which you would interact with students and perhaps staff as well.

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Whitehall

Yeah.

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White

And can I – Jimmy has that been a concern of yours because I think you have been worried about the social distancing aspect as well, haven’t you?

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Bryden

I usually use a long cane but I get guided mostly just around shops and stuff, but yeah, that’s been a concern – the social distancing – and having to be close, physically close, to people just to get what you need to do done.Ìý I think there are exceptions, the government have said, because I was just scared that someone is just going to say no, we’re not going to help and then you’re stuck in a shop or something by yourself.

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White

But despite that, you’re there, you’re dealing with it, you’ve decided to crash on through?

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Bryden

Well I took – it was – six months off from school and I was seriously considering taking a gap year but I didn’t want to take a year and a half off so I thought I’d come and give it a go and see how it goes.

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White

Okay, right.Ìý Well, two people listening in are Elin Williams, she’s from Look-UK, which is an organisation which sees part of its role as mentoring young people and helping them navigate all kinds of situations, including university and college and Rachel Hewett is from the Visual Impairment Centre for Teaching and Research at Birmingham University and has done a lot of work on the student experience for visually impaired people.Ìý If I can go to you first Rachel, this wouldn’t have been an issue when you started to do this work but it’s clearly worrying Jimmy and Carys, what would you say to them?

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Hewett

Hearing their tales, it just brings it all the more to light and it was the main theme that has been concerning me about students going back to university this year.Ìý And the one thing that I’d say is, I think that normally when students are in this situation I would be saying – or going back to university – I would be saying look to be as independent as possible.Ìý But I think in these situations, in the times that we’re in, there is a need to draw on as much support as possible.Ìý So, for example, one suggestion that I’ve heard is students being able to access through Disabled Student Allowance sighted guide support from someone within their bubble.Ìý So, that’s been one suggestion that people within their bubble could act as a sighted guide and there was training available to facilitate that.

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White

But is that actually happening, you say it’s a suggestion, is it happening, it sounds as if it hasn’t happened to Jimmy?

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Hewett

No, there should be the logistics in place to do that.Ìý I mean, obviously, this is all such a new situation for universities and they’re learning how to adapt and I think putting suggestions forward like that could be really helpful.

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White

Elin, what are your thoughts on this?

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Williams

Well, we’re mainly concerned about the impact on VI students’ mental health going back, if they are going back to university or starting university for the first time this term, because so much of the structures and the systems that would normally be in place to support VI students aren’t available at the moment.Ìý So, you know, as we’ve already heard, mobility support isn’t as readily available and the things to do with the kind of academic learning as well, you know, a lot of universities now are using – doing a lot of the learning online but we all know that making it online doesn’t automatically make it accessible, so there seems to be new hurdles and challenges to kind of get through and we’re concerned that VI students, in particular, aren’t able to access the support that they might normally do which can have a knock on effect on their mental wellbeing.

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White

Right, let me go back to Jimmy on this because of course what we mustn’t forget in all this is you’ve come here to work and that’s what it’s about, to get a degree.Ìý It’s early days but how clear are you on what to expect, do you have a timetable, do you know the balance between online work and face-to-face tuition and how are you feeling about all that?

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Bryden

Timetables are a bit of a nightmare.Ìý I mean I’ve had my timetable for less than 24 hours for this week, so it’s… There is some on-campus teaching, I think it’s going to be like a dual delivery, as far as I’m aware, but, as I said, I’ve only got my timetable last night so I’m going to do it all online because I can’t physically get there today or tomorrow because it’s too short notice…

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White

And, you know, Rachel mentioned accessibility – how accessible is it going to be, do you know, have you had a chance to look?

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Bryden

I’ve had some lecture notes, I’ve looked at some problem sheets and I’ve had some sample lecture notes sent through.Ìý They look like they’re going to be accessible, the only problem I have is that it takes the screenreader I use quite a long time to load it, so sometimes I do have to like open a document and then go and make a cup of tea and come back and then it’s loaded up.Ìý And it does crash quite a bit with the canvas pages and stuff.

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White

I want to ask Rachel, what has Jimmy and students like him, what’s he got the right to expect at this point and what should he do if he’s not getting what he wants?

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Hewett

Yeah, it’s interesting hearing about the timetabling.Ìý It has been such a challenge this year because of obviously reduced capacity in rooms, we just didn’t know how many students would actually turn up.Ìý In terms of the accessibility of notes, obviously he has the right to expect that materials are prepared in an accessible format.Ìý But saying that, there is going to a period of learning as well, they’ll be a period of learning from lecturers about what formats Jimmy needs materials to be in, what is going to work best with his software.Ìý And I’d really encourage Jimmy to have that open dialogue with his disability support officer and with the lecturers, just to iron out any tweaks that emerge over the first few weeks.

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White

There has been some talking going on, as far as Jimmy’s course is concerned.Ìý I mean the point that strikes me is you’re at a new place, you’ve got to try and cope and something’s wrong, it’s not easy, is it, to go to people and say this isn’t working, you’re not doing it right?

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Hewett

Yeah, I absolutely accept that and obviously the responsibility is on the university to get it right.Ìý One thing that the University of Birmingham’s doing this year, which I think is going to work really well, is we’re holding weekly tutorials, which just gives an opportunity for students to talk about any difficulties that they might be facing, so raise those issues in a fairly informal place.

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White

Let me bring Elin in on that.Ìý Look has collaborated, I think, on guidance for university staff, both support staff and teachers, what were the key points you wanted to make them aware of?

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Williams

A lot of what we’ve already talked about to be honest.Ìý The main points that we covered in the guidance that we worked on with Thomas Pocklington Trust and Guide Dogs, it is aimed at higher education providers but it’s also perfectly accessible for students and parents of students and for anybody to read it.Ìý So, the main things that are covered in there are things about getting around, so orientation and mobility around campus, different things to consider and ways to support students with that.Ìý Then we go on to the kind of online learning situation and in particular assessments and exams because we’ve heard from many students that it’s quite difficult to conduct like an online exam if you’re using assistive tech and you haven’t had a chance to kind of familiarise yourself with that platform beforehand.Ìý And then obviously, the kind of social aspects as well, so, especially the students living in shared housing and kind of reduced social opportunities as well.Ìý It’s available on the Look website and the Thomas Pocklington Trust and Guide Dogs website.Ìý It’s very kind of comprehensive, we recommend that students have it to hand and read through it as well, so that students, like Jimmy, know what they can ask for and what they can expect from their institution.

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White

And Rachel, I understand that amid all the concern you think that from an access point of view, I’m talking about online stuff in particular, the current situation could be an opportunity – how come?

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Hewett

It’s a funny way to look at it isn’t it?Ìý But I do think that in terms of the research that I’ve undertaken and the problems that we’ve identified that there could be some positives to this.Ìý So, for example, I know one major challenge that students face was not getting material ahead of teaching sessions, now material should be available online ahead, so that they’ll be able to access it at the same time as their peers.Ìý Other things as well like reading lists, again this is drawing on my experience at Birmingham, but we had a policy that all reading lists had to be made available well in advance, so that we can ensure that all texts were available electronically because obviously there’s less opportunity to go into libraries at the moment.Ìý So, I think things like that are going to be removing some of the barriers that students have faced in the past.

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White

Okay.Ìý Now, we’re getting near the end but one thing we’ve not talked much about is the social side of this, we’ve talked about education.Ìý Carys, this time last year you were where Jimmy is now, I want you to pass on the – if only I’d known that then – moments.Ìý What would your advice be to him, allowing for the very odd situation you’re in but nonetheless, university is university isn’t it.

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Whitehall

Definitely.Ìý I think, yeah, I mean it’s difficult because I would say try and go to as many events as you can, which unfortunately, I was a little bit hesitant to do because I’m quite an introverted person, whereas next year I’ll be telling myself – no, you’ve got to get out and do it.Ìý And that’s something I would say is – you’re not a burden.Ìý I know I feel it sometimes, oh gosh I can’t ask that because people are going to think oh there’s the blind girl over there she always needs help, she always need an arm, you know but actually, no, 99% of the time people are more than happy – yeah grab on – and then you kind of end up having a chat about your day-to-day uni life and you find that you have a lot in common with people.Ìý And that’s kind of how you get introduced into friendship groups I feel, if you actually say – excuse me, can you help me find where the pineapple pots are on the rack here in this canteen?Ìý They’ll go – Oh, of course – and you start chatting.Ìý And that’s something I would 100% advise is don’t be afraid to ask for help.Ìý Always think, look I’m not burdening this person, it’s an opportunity, a great opportunity, to start a conversation with someone.

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White

Was that something genuinely that you felt, that – sometimes – that you were a burden?

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Whitehall

Definitely, it was a bit like why can’t I just get on with it and do it myself.Ìý And there are sometimes, yes, you can do it yourself and other times there are genuine reasons why you would need that help.Ìý And actually it’s better, instead of getting supported help, because if you’re constantly with your support, so your sighted guide, that kind of almost isolates you in a sense from your peers, so if you actually say – oh, I’d rather walk with my friend today, if that’s okay, with my sighted guide behind – that is also okay and you’re more than entitled to do that.

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White

Just one thing, Carys, I must just ask you with all the news over the weekend, are you feeling a bit smug about the decision you made?

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Whitehall

Oh, 100% honestly, because when I made the decision I had a lot of raised eyebrows and – oh really, aren’t you wasting your education – all that and now I’m thinking to myself – I am so, so glad about the decision I’ve just made because my mental health would have been in shreds if I’d have been kept away from home over Christmas, if it does happen and yeah, stay.

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White

Jimmy, you are ploughing on, you’re there, what will you take from this discussion?

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Bryden

Well as Carys said you’ve just got to try and talk to as many people as possible and I completely get what you mean, like, you do feel like a burden asking people – can you help me go to the shop or if you’re going to the shop can I come with you – stuff like – because it…

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White

Because I…

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Bryden

…it’s a weird line between friendship and someone actually helping you.

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White

Yeah.Ìý And I can remember the temptation to turn invitations down and that sort of thing, it’s so much easier to sort of – when – at the beginning with all the noise and the row and everything going on, it’s easy to say – I think I’ll just read a book.

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Will you be tempted to do that?

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Bryden

I’ve already done that.Ìý I’ve tried to be as sociable as I can but I’ve already just gone, you know I can’t – it’s just too stressful today, I will just read or something.

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Whitehall

I have to say I fell into that trap because of the degree that I – I was reading English and I’d almost use it as excuse because you have an awful lot of reading when you’re studying literature.Ìý But it’s almost like – Oh I’m so sorry guys, I can’t come out with you tonight because I’ve got to finish this book for tomorrow morning.Ìý And actually, yeah, I probably could have gone out, you know, so that is an easy trap to fall into.

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White

Okay.Ìý So, Carys and I would both say to you Jimmy, in spite of all the problems that are going on, embrace it, try and enjoy it.

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That is all we’ve got time for.Ìý Time will tell how it’s all going to pan out but, in the meantime, we’d like to hear your experiences, whether you’re a current VI student coping with the situation at the moment or anything you’d like to pass on just from your past experience, whenever it happened.Ìý Meanwhile, many thanks to Rachel Hewett and to Elin Williams and the very best of luck to Carys Whitehall, when you do start again, and Jimmy Bryden as they plot their course.Ìý You can email intouch@bbc.co.uk or go to our website bbc.co.uk/intouch.Ìý

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From me, Peter White, producer Mike Young and studio manager Richard Hannaford.Ìý Goodbye.