Wars and ConflictsĀ permalink
The āNerry Gunāā¦
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Message 1.Ā
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Wednesday, 1st December 2010
Can anyone help shed some light on a boyhood memoryā¦
As a lad I was taken on a visit to the Woolwich area and watching a colourful display of troops square bashing on a parade ground, with massed bands doing their stuff, and being shown a Russian bronze cannon, captured at Sebastopolā¦ the one that the VCās were all alleged to have been cast from. (now proven to be wrong)
And later on, a visit to a military museum which makes me think it may have been the Royal Artillery Museum, if indeed there is oneā¦
As is to be expected, with the passing of time, the memory of this visit has dimmed somewhatā¦ but I have vivid recall of others, and I seem to remember it being housed in some kind of a giant bell tent, and itās this thatās causing me the problem, the unlikelihood of such a location, but then the childhood memory recalls it was called the āRotundraā, or something similar, and Iāve never found the place again, or any mention of it.
As a young boy scout, the exploits of Baden-Powell, the Boar War and Mafeking were although not exactly still fresh in peopleās mindsā¦ there were enough of the older generation still around for whom it was ātheir timeāā¦ and they still talked about it as their yesterdayā¦ i.e. Corporal Jones, and his fuzzy wuzzies, and how āthey donāt like it up āemā, from the dads army sketchesā¦ remembering at the time, that we were closer then to The Boar Warā¦ than were are now to the Second World Warā¦ and thereās still plenty of talk and memories about that.
What Iāve been searching for, for years thoughā¦ is information relating to an old artillery piece spirited together at the siege of Mafeking with more than a smattering of pure genius from sections of old railway lines and the wheels and carriage parts of old agricultural implements, and I believe they even made their own shells for itā¦. It truly amazed me then, and now how it was doneā¦ from railway linesā¦? And I think it was called the āNerry Gunā.
Another thing that caught my eyeā¦ thou I canāt remember if it were at the same museumā¦ was a communication devise mounted on a pair of periscope binoculars that could transmit speech over the battleground as long as the two parties were within sightā¦ the transmission being carried on a light wave, and therefore secret. No wires and no radio wavesā¦ brilliant. Try as I might I canāt find any information about them eitherā¦ but I remember my father also telling me about them when I became interested in radio as a boy.
No doubt Iāve got a lot of this wrongā¦ and someoneās hopefully going to get a load of satisfaction telling me soā¦
And the kindest of regards to those that doā¦ bandick. -
Message 2
Posted by CASSEROLEON (U11049737) on Wednesday, 1st December 2010
bandick
Thomas Pakenham's account of the Boer War has a section on Mafeking's improvised weapons etc- including a fuel made of equal parts of cow dung and coal dust. He mentions 2 guns.
"Wolf" started life as a piece of 4 inch pipe. They added bits from a threshing machine for a chassis, and cast a breech in the railway foundry. The Wolf could throw an 18-pound shell 4000 yards.
"Lord Nelson" was a brass cannon dated 1770 that was serving as a gate-post . The local tribe had bought it as a protection against Boer raiders- and it amused everyone that it was engraved "BP & Co" . It was used to fire 10 pound solid cannon balls.
Cass -
Message 3
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Wednesday, 1st December 2010
Hi Cassā¦ thanks for taking the time, interesting recipe for fuelā¦
Iāve read such a lot of stuff over the yearsā¦ and never really noted the book titles etc. So I get a bookā¦ then find out I have read it an age agoā¦ very frustratingā¦ bet you donāt do that.
Iāll see about Thomas Pakenhamās book at the libraryā¦ although I have a mobile library comes once a monthā¦ Iām a bit off the beaten track you see.
I was aware of āLord Nelsonā but it was only your reference to it being a gate post that triggered the memoryā¦ and the other one āwolfāā¦ I think that shows promiseā¦ as Iāve saidā¦ memories do fade with the passage of timeā¦ but I know the tribesmen had that name for himā¦ quote wikiā¦
I think its also in 'scouting for boys'
Interesting reference to the railways modificationsā¦ any idea where these guns are Cassā¦ coz Iāve seen the one Iām afterā¦ strange āNerry Gunā seems to trigger nothing thou.
Methinks its time to get back to the drawing boardsā¦but Iāll go nuts if I lose the internet again todayā¦
Kind regardsā¦ bandick -
Message 4
Posted by Triceratops (U3420301) on Wednesday, 1st December 2010
Bandick,
The Nerry Gun you refer to, I think means the gun in Imperial War Museum which was used in the Action at Nery, 1st September 1914.
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Message 5
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Wednesday, 1st December 2010
Triceratopsā¦ I think youāve cracked this little nutā¦ and now I think I need to concentrate my energies into researching early onset of Alzheimer's and learn how to cope with Dementia.
Obviously memory can fade, given the passage of time etc. but having now looked into your wiki referenceā¦ Iām pretty sure itās not āmyā gunā¦ the one in the picture is a real one, a proper jobā¦ nothing home made about thatā¦ but then thereās the nameā¦I have been to the IWM a number of times in my pre teen yearsā¦ and twice since, the last being over thirty years agoā¦ so I have no idea where Iāve got confused with ānerryā being the name of a gunā¦
āmyā gun was definitely at the Woolwich tent thingy.
āMyā gun was a homemade assortment of partsā¦ a squat looking thing, beautifully crafted and perhaps in the end a figment of my imaginationā¦ perhaps itās time to give up, sit back and slowly begin to dribble.
How does one find out about museums etcā¦.?
Regards bandick. -
Message 6
Posted by Triceratops (U3420301) on Wednesday, 1st December 2010
Bandick,
These are the links to the Artillery Museum in Woolwich and the Army Museum in Chelsea;
There was another gun produced during the Boer War at the De Beers workshop in Kimberley;
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Message 7
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Friday, 10th December 2010
Within the covers of āBaden-Powell, The Hero of Mafekingā, on Baden-Powell, BP, is a passage well known to many an old Boy Scout:
The Matabele called him āImpeesaāā¦ (Wolf), which his āboyā whom he called āDiamondā because he was āA jewel of a servantā translated, āThe beast that does not sleep, but sneaks about at nightā.
Iām sure when I saw the film āThe Virgin Soldiersā back in the 60s, there was a parody on those words, spoken by, letās see if the memories got this rightā¦ the well known actor now playing Detective Superintendent Charles Wycliffe in the TV series Wycliffe, ā¦ Jack Shepherdā¦?
Anyway āWolfā is of course very well known within the Scouting Movement. The totem atop their flag pole, various awards, the emblem on their cap badges, and the name by which they were known for yearsā¦ i.e. Wolf Cubs, and so forthā¦
Not the reason for me to rule out its namesake from my search for this elusive gunā¦ bearing in mind Iād seen it. Heaven knows where Iād got the impression all these years for it be the āNerry gunāā¦ truth be to tell, I canāt see how else that name should ever have be known to me. Howeverā¦ having spent hours dredging through the darkest depths of my trusty old steam driven PC, I have come across the same passages written and re-written time and time againā¦ but this time with an all important reference I was looking for, āstrengthened by rails bent into ringsā.
<_Another gun soon came into action: home-made in Mafeking, in a furnace made of a cistern lined with bricks. The gun was made of a 4-inch steel furnace pipe strengthened by rails bent into rings. The chassis came from an old threshing machine. Spherical shells were made by melting down scrap metal. The gun could fire an 8kg projectile almost 4000 metres.
The gun was named `The Wolf' in honour of Baden-Powell: Impeesa, the Wolf that never sleeps._>
So many thanks to all those that helped solve this mystery, and for Triceratops giving me the Royal Artillery web address.
I contacted themā¦ and received this morningā¦
<_Thank you for your recent communication.
Prior to its removal to Larkhill, a large Monument did stand in the centre of the Woolwich parade ground flanked on either side by the Victoria Cross guns. Initially thought to be Russian they are in fact Chinese. The Guns are now on display here in Firepower, the Royal Artillery Museum.
The round building you remember was the Museum of Artillery in the Rotunda. Now closed the collection has been relocated here in the newly built museum within the walls of the Royal Arsenal.
The Boer War gun you remember is the āWolf Gunā and it is displayed upstairs in the main history gallery here in Firepower, the Royal Artillery Museum.
We donāt have an example of the communications device you mention.
Yours etc etc._>
kind regards to everyone Bandick -
Message 8
Posted by CASSEROLEON (U11049737) on Friday, 10th December 2010
Well done bandick
Cass -
Message 9
Posted by Sambista (U4068266) on Saturday, 11th December 2010
Re the comms device - are you sure it wasn't just a heliograph?
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Message 10
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Saturday, 11th December 2010
±«°ł²Ō³Ü²Ō²µ²¹±ōā¦
Well after getting the name of the gun wrong, and being so resolute about it in my own mind, I hardly know what to sayā¦ I have thought about those blessed things for yearsā¦ I wanted some. I loved mucking about with old radios when I was a kid; itās the only thing my father ever seemed to spend time with me about.
But he got the radio ābugā in its infancy. He told me he and a group of friends, (this could be the early days of amateur radio) built a one valve transmitter, with a range of over twenty miles. They knew nothing of the importance of proper tuned aerials at the time and just threw a length of wire out the windowā¦ he and his fellow enthusiasts had them in their carsā¦ my father had an old three wheeler Morganā¦ and they used to go out shooting around Pegwell Bay nr. Ramsgateā¦ I have an old photo somewhere of him, my mother and his friends posing by the cars with the days shoot, with the cars in the background. One of them had a strange frame on the back, like the sort of thing youād wind wool onā¦ maybe an early Ariel experiment, but he always laughed at their carās not being big enough to carry the batteries.
Years past and I came along; he must have rued the dayā¦
One day he came home from work looking rather pleased with himself, and told me to put my hand out. Fearing a damned good slap for some misdemeanour I did so with the usual trepidation and after foraging about his personā¦ divesting himself from his motorcycle gear, a huge dispatch riders coat, several jackets, gum boots, ex police crash helmet with obligatory spitfire pilots goggles and a huge mile long yellow scarfā¦ he looked like the invisible man, he carefully placed a whopping great valve in my hot sticky hands. It was about seven or eight inches long and had a golden coating. It looked more like something youād expect to place atop the Christmas tree, demoting the rather forlorn looking fairy.
He said it was a special, I forget what he called it, thou a āpilot valveā comes to mind, and with no more than eight or nine other components he pulled from various pockets, we spent the evening huddled over a hot soldering iron and a glowing valve. It took him some time to remember the circuit, but with so few parts he managed it over a few nights (he was a clever old dad).
We left it on the table, set a clock ticking next to the microphone and went out in the car, we took a homemade new fangled transistor radio with us, ready tuned to receive the best signalā¦. and true to his word, we got a good 15-20 miles before the signal faded. (I still have the mike) we had a lot of fun with it for a long time. But I never could reproduce itā¦ couldnāt get the right valve.
Right so, back to these binoculars. I was fascinated with them, and described what Iād seen. Father went on and on way over my head I supposeā¦ explaining the relationship between the speed of light, and that of radio signals in a vacuum chamber blab la blaā¦ etc etc etcā¦ a bit heavy perhaps for a ten or twelve year old boy, but he had a way that if he was interested, youād learn.
Wherever the museum was, there was a mock up trench, with duck boards, boxes of ammo, debris, tin helmets, ration boxes, mud, firing platformsā¦ manikins firing over the top etc. and these two tripods with the periscope binoculars, loads of personal effectsā¦ examples of Christmas rations, trench art and a whole plethora of fascinating goodies. Everything was labelled with a good description of what it was and its use. I suppose, maybeā¦ just maybe, there may have been a heliograph on display, as you suggest, I donāt know, I think I was too absorbed with the binoculars, but the display was crammed with bits and piecesā¦ It could however, explain the confusion one might have as a kid, with his nose glued to the glass screen be looking at one thing and reading the wrong label. Itās eluded me for such a long time, and was one of the first things I searched for when a friend showed off his computer and the internet.
Soā¦ Iāve prattled on a bit, and I do apologise but only to allay any thoughts that my memory has deserted me completelyā¦ but on the other hand I suppose Iām just chasing yet another dream.
I think you have the right answer to this one too ±«°ł²Ō³Ü²Ō²µ²¹±ōā¦ (your turn to set the next question)
Kind regards bandick.
Psā¦ Heliograph, I had no idea they were in use until such recent times.
We used a CD, and sight it with a stick while looking through the hole. Works a treat across Poole harbour. -
Message 11
Posted by Triceratops (U3420301) on Sunday, 12th December 2010
Glad to have been of help Bandick.
These periscope binoculars are straight forward observation devices,
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Message 12
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Sunday, 12th December 2010
Yupā¦ they look just rightā¦ even with the rabbit ears descriptionā¦ in the display an officer wearing a greatcoat and peaked cap was stooped over a table writing in a note bookā¦
I bet there was a field telephone somewhere, that could have added to the confusionā¦ there was just so much to take in, for a kid. -
Message 13
Posted by Sambista (U4068266) on Sunday, 12th December 2010
Bandick:
From memory, military wireless at that date was pretty much WT - often wide-frequency spark transmitters. By my time, other than the near-obligatory attempt to build a crystal set at home, most people had access to fairly sophisticated gear, but the licencing implications meant that it was difficult to go on the air. First experience of transmitting legitimately came via Cadets at school, on ex-WD No 19 sets. Bit safer than my father's signals experience in the Ā鶹Ō¼ÅÄ Guard. The CO was ex-RN, and set up his HQ atop a local slag heap, using semaphore to communicate to his outliers. Not a popular job in the event of an enemy actually landing. -
Message 14
Posted by bandick (U14360315) on Monday, 13th December 2010
Urnungal
Fascinating piece on early radios featured on coast last nightā¦ with Dick Strawbrige and a substantial group of volunteers, they reproduced with a few pieces of original equipment some of Marconiās early experiments in Irelandā¦ spark gap generators, etc and a magnificent Morse key. I tried recording it while I was watchingā¦ not quick enough Iām afraid. But I bet a penny to a pinch ofā¦. no doubt it will be repeated. I must pay more attention next time.
Your mention of the WD no 19 setā¦ sent the brain box into overdriveā¦ I never used one, but Iāve seen them, being a regular visitor to the tank museum at Bovington, they were originally built for armoured vehicles, but didnāt that then develop into the standard army issue. Itās quite a big chunky set as I recallā¦ but still only giving a Morse facility...? Iām sure I read somewhere they were that well built and in such numbers thereās still quite a few āknockingā around todayā¦ some having āfallenā into the hands of amateur radio enthusiasts.
Just a few years ago I bought two tank radios at a boat jumble, brand new and still in sealed boxes. The same size as a car radioā¦ in fact I got them to be converted into taxi radiosā¦ Ā£20 the two. How times change. -
Message 15
Posted by Sambista (U4068266) on Monday, 13th December 2010
The 19 was a WWII set, the W/T only comment related to WWI, actually. Sme 19s were pure HF sets, with an intercomm for the tank crew, some had a "B" set - VHF?? for inter-tank comms within the squadron. We had 38s sets too - backpack style which could talk to the 19s on a few of the allocated frequencies.
As to 19s still being around - probably, as long as they are left with the valve heater circuits on. You can still get the vital transmitter valves - 807 tetrodes IIRC - quite cheaply.
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