Wars and ConflictsΜύ permalink
Agree Or Disagree?
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Message 1.Μύ
Posted by NoNameNoFace (U1652129) on Monday, 22nd February 2010
Whats your opinions on his quote?
"Any crime committed by a man in the name of his freedom can never be as great as the crime committed by the man who took that freedom away."
Discuss. -
Message 2
Posted by Backtothedarkplace (U2955180) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
That it was probably written by some one who wasnt expecting to have to fight anybody?
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Message 3
Posted by WeeJemmy (U14316099) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
Wotcha mean by 'Freedom'?
There's a lot of people in jails here and there that would commit any crime to get their 'freedom' to commit even greater crimes when they get out!
Political 'Freedom'?
Wotcha mean by that, then? In the Workers' Paradises of Eastern Europe, everyone was 'Free' and 'Equal' - so free and equal, in fact that hundreds of them died trying to escape to live under 'Capitalist Oppression' in the West.
Almost every country who gained their 'Freedom' in the last 50 years has used it to have a good old Civil War, just like we did when we got some here!
I suspect many of the ordinary people in the old British Empire were physically and legally better off under British Oppression than they are now. -
Message 4
Posted by TimTrack (U1730472) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
"Any crime committed by a man in the name of his freedom can never be as great as the crime committed by the man who took that freedom away."
There most certainly are times where vilence is justified. But the concept of proportionality has to be taken in to account.
South Africa in the apartheid era was not a democracy. Therefore resistance was justifiable. But that does not allow un-limited means.
If the anti-apartheid movement had obtained a nuclear device, using it would not be justified because the effect would be disproportionate.
Likewise, Palestinians shooting up children in an airport lounge is also both disproportionate and also attacks those innocent of oppression.
So, in short, being oppressed is not carte blanche to use any violence you choose.
The end only justifies certain means. -
Message 5
Posted by Frank Parker (U7843825) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
Just to take an example from the last week (which probably doesn't count as history, but then this is more to do with philosophy that history anyway)
The guy who flew his plane into the Texas tax office because he thought the IRS was taking away his freedom to spend his money as he chose could have killed people. Luckily he didn't. But I think it illustrates the stupidity of the remark. BTW who is supposed to have said it?
On the other hand, of course, the whole notion of MAD was based on just that philosophy. -
Message 6
Posted by Grumpyfred (U2228930) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
The freedom to plant bombs regardless of who it kills? Mostly (As in Ireland) while having your hands out to the British for state handouts. The Freedom to torture, but then cry foul if their human rights are infringed. The Freedom to demand to come over here and live off our handouts while planning to plant bombs,while demanding we leave their country. But any suggestion that they leave ours is considered racist.
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Message 7
Posted by Frank Parker (U7843825) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
The freedom to plant bombs regardless of who it kills? Mostly (As in Ireland) while having your hands out to the British for state handoutsΜύ
Sorry if my comment comes across like your name - grumpy - but I assume you are actually referring to the part of "the British state" known as Northern Ireland. I am not aware of Ireland seeking handouts from the UK.
Nor do I think the bombers were seeking hand-outs - they were/are (and indeed there are some still active as today's news shows) seeking to leave "the British state". -
Message 8
Posted by Grumpyfred (U2228930) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
If you check your facts, you will be surprised just how many of the IRA (And indeed terrorists on the other side) were drawing benefit from the British DWP.
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Message 9
Posted by Grumpyfred (U2228930) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
One of the jokes of the troubles (If you could call it so) was the only Government building you were safe in in N I was the D S S office as a bomb planted there could delay their payements.
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Message 10
Posted by stalti (U14278018) on Tuesday, 23rd February 2010
GF
agreed - if you can remember the Sun (who else) did an article in the 70s/80s on exactly this
how many ira prisoners who were on the dole before they were jailed, how many prisoners wifes were on benefits even tho they hated us - how many in the catholic areas were on housing benefit
not a lot changes then - british islamic terrorists have education and a free life supported by the people they hate
bit of a luxury - being able to hate and bomb people who give u the space to do this
st -
Message 11
Posted by Mikestone8 (U13249270) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
One of the jokes of the troubles (If you could call it so) was the only Government building you were safe in in N I was the D S S office as a bomb planted there could delay their payementsΜύ
Not to mention killing too many people on their own side. -
Message 12
Posted by Spruggles (U13892773) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
Please see 'Animal Farm'
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Message 13
Posted by White Camry (U2321601) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
Frank Parker,
The guy who flew his plane into the Texas tax office because he thought the IRS was taking away his freedom to spend his money as he chose could have killed people. Luckily he didn't.Μύ
He killed an IRS employee in the building.
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Message 14
Posted by an ex-nordmann - it has ceased to exist (U3472955) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
Whats your opinions on his quote?
"Any crime committed by a man in the name of his freedom can never be as great as the crime committed by the man who took that freedom away."
Discuss
Μύ
My opinion is threefold, since you ask;
Its author understands little about use of the negative assertive in English. "Any crime can never" does not make grammatical sense. The correct phrase should be "No crime can ever", regardless of however many other words might be employed to pad it out into a longer sentence.
The author attempts to produce an assertion from the repetition of a subjective interpolation of the concept of freedom. Two subjective assertions serve only to advertise the potentially fallacial thinking in use. Two fallacial subjectives serve simply confirm it.
He or she who composed the quote is unfamiliar with the basic rules concerning the retention of meaning and sense in the written and spoken word, but knows even less about avoiding the accidental transfer of Unicode Byte Order Marks between word processing applications. -
Message 15
Posted by Spruggles (U13892773) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
Ouch!
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Message 16
Posted by WeeJemmy (U14316099) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
Ouch, indeed, but I have to agree.
The assertion is badly written bovine excreta, too general to be really meaningful. -
Message 17
Posted by WarsawPact (U1831709) on Wednesday, 24th February 2010
"Any crime committed by a man in the name of his freedom can never be as great as the crime committed by the man who took that freedom away."
Sounds like a rather fatuous attempt to justify terrorism to me.
Until we know who made the 'quote' though, I'd question it's relevance to a history message-board. -
Message 18
Posted by Andrew Host (U1683626) on Thursday, 25th February 2010
Hi all,
This thread is off-topic for the W&C board.
Thread closed.
Andrew
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