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Posted by Flobblem (U13967960) on Friday, 29th May 2009
I know the main ones, El Alamain and The Bulge, but I don't know much about them. I was hoping that the learned people of this forum could help me.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
Stalingrad!
BoB. (Battle of Britain).
And Midway!
AA.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
Battle of the Atlantic - (mostly) Max Horton V Karl Doenitz
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
I think Arnald Almerac (msg 2) was spot-on. The Battle of Kursk needs to be added too.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
Whilst it was the last major offensive launched by the Germans on the Eastern Front and was called off/failed, I don't think there was anything decisive about it.
The most decisive battle on the Eastern Front must surely be the destruction of Army Group Centre during Operation Bagration, June-August 1944.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
Both El Alamein and the Battle of the Bulge were found against a German opponent who was already exhausted and had little hope to avoid defeat. That makes them somewhat less than decisive.
If there were turning points, they were probably the Battles of Britain, Moscow, and Midway. These really changed the course of the war.
On the longer term, probably the battles of Stalingrad, Guadalcanal and Tunis were also crucial for the damage they did.
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In what way do you think the Battle of Britain was decisive?
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
We beat the Germans 1-0 after extra time, but only after cheating and bringing on none British subs, in the form of Polish Chec French etc.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
Haha I like that analogy Fred ;D I suppose the Japanese were offside?
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No, the B of B was of course for the Europian Cup, Japan entered a team for the World Cup.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
We beat the Germans 1-0 after extra time, but only after cheating and bringing on none British subs, in the form of Polish Chec French etcΒ
Wellington also presided over a similar polyglot army at Waterloo, if I recall correctly. The British armed forces are like the England cricket team - nationality has never been a bar to selection.
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In this, we are not alone. Most of the U S cricket team were born elsewhere, and the joke about the Irish Rugby team was if your'e Grandfather visited (Or even flew over) Ireland, you could play for Ireland.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
According to Churchill's assistant secretary, Jock Colville, Churchill knew before the Battle of Britain started that there was no realistic threat of an invasion as the Germans didn't have sufficient naval assets to make it a practical operation. He chose to "spin" the threat in order to consolidate British morale and resolve. I'd accept that, as a way of convincing the British not to seek a negotiated peace, the BofB may have been important, but I'm not sure it can fairly be described as "decisive"
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
So, if the R A F had been shot out of the skies, then the factories turning out the replacement tanks and guns had been bombed, Hitler would have said. "Well I don't intend to invade England after all." I think not. The Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ fleet may have some south, but as was proved off Malaya, capital ships without fighter escort are just moving targets. The F A As fighters could have not taken on the 109s, and the Junkers 87s (As proved later in the Med.) would have had a field day along with the J U 88s and H 111s. If Edward (Who Hitler was thinking of returning the the throne) wanted to inspect the Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ Fleet after receiving the crown, he would have to it by submarine.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
I think the essential question resolved in the battle of Britain was whether Britain would continue to fight the war, or sign a second Peace of Amiens which would leave the Third Reich in control of the continent.
The threat of invasion was probably largely symbolic. Although real preparations for the invasion were made, the probability of success was low and Hitler was very reluctant to give the order.
But there was a significant current of political opinion in Britain which favored a peace deal with Hitler, or even saw him as a possible ally against Communism. (Even today there is a line of thinking in extremely conservative circles in the UK, that defeating Hitler was not worth the sacrifice of the Empire. Not that the Empire would have survived any way.) If the RAF had been defeated, that and the threat of invasion might have been enough to topple Churchill's government and end the war. We know that there was debate on the possibilities of a negotiated peace in British government circles.
And it was, after all, what everybody expected that would happen in July 1940 -- The French, the Germans, the Italians, even many Americans. And the future of Europe would probably have been very different if it had happened.
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Also the USA would have concentrated on fighting the Japanese, D-Day would not have happened and the whole of mainland Europe (if Stalin had not made a compromise peace the likelihood of which was a;so increased) would have fallen prey to a Nazi or Communist dictatorship. The Battle of Britain also showed that the Nazi war machine was fallible and capable of being stopped in its tracks.
Link to this forum: Who commanded and where were the most decisive battles of WW2?
The RAF could not have been "shot out of the skies" north or west of the line which represented the limit of range of the Bf109s. Take a look at what happened when the "northern prong" of the Adlerangriff attempted to launch its air assault on the north-east - one day convinced them it was not on. That would have left the bulk of the nation's prouctive capacity open to air attack only by unescorted bombers - and in daylight at that, if they wanted any kind of chance of hitting precision targets. At that stage, RDF was no help once the enemy aircraft crossed the coast - but the ROC were tracking and reporting raids well enough for fighters from 10 & 12 groups to fall on the bombers the moment the escorts had to break off - other, of course, than the Me110s, which proved such wonderful escort fighters that they had to be provided with escorts themselves.
By September, the nights were long enough for destroyers (and cruisers) from outside the area that the Luftwaffe could control (by day only) to fall on the convoys, largely of towed barges, which for a fair part of the more than 24-hour crossing could barely stem the tidal stream. Raeder knew that the KM, which at that point had almost all its ships larger than a light cruiser out of action, couldn't protect a landing large enough to pose a real threat, that's why he kept saying that Goering should be allowed to carry on the air assault to the point where British resistance collapsed, and an occupation, not an invasion, was all that would be required.
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