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How successful was the 'Paris Gun' in action and did it survive the 1st World War?
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Message 1.Β
Posted by RSS_643_IKWIG (U13662597) on Wednesday, 13th May 2009
Wednesday. 13th May, 2009. 09:39BST
Re. 'Paris Gun'
NB. Whilst the 'public record' regarding the so called 'Paris Gun' is out there somewhere (I, myself would have to consult an old copy of WAR MONTHLY); there is 'a tale to tell' which is bewildering and possibly apocryphal. That is; that the first 'test and evaluation' fired single 'round' or shell: actually never came down...
Krupps; the designers and manufacturers of 'the piece' (and possibly her sisters); who built the so called 'Paris Gun' on behalf of (probably) the Imperial German Navy; 'bit their lip' (in that quaint phrase) and noted that; like the characters in a contemporary 'Jules Verne' or 'H.G. Wells' novel: they had possibly entered the 'space race'...
Whilst the weapon in action; was reported to have fired a shell some 76 - 79 miles in distance; from beyond the outskirts of Paris to the very heart of government: there was a 'tactical report' which mentioned 128 miles and a 'close set Detail' which mentioned 250 miles...
The 'test and evaluation' was commenced; according to some reports with an angle in elevation of some '70degrees' from the horizontal; as seen in the classic Krupps photograph: possibly recorded after its completion but before the 'test rig' was finalised...
ps. The history of naval gunnery was a 'closed set' in the late 19th Century and no doubt; 'the lenght of shot' was all important. Espionage was for both 'national' and 'commercial' reasons not to be encouraged; albeit it was widely practised.
The 'weird Detail' is 'two - fold'. Firstly there was the understanding that 'Walsingham's CANNON' was a known point of discussion since the 16th Century but that 'the secret' lay heavy with meaning; 'for all who held their breath': let alone 'their tongues'. It was understood that the 1st World War was prefigured in the poetry of Thomas Hardy amongst others. A case in point; being: 'Channel Firing' (written by Thomas Hardy) and which noted both the beginnings of a 'Rabballan Century' and included a reference to the 'barrel fan' of 'stourton tower' and a 'danse Macabre' or 'dance of death'. Thomas Hardy actually conversed with several people associated with the Naval Locker at Pegwell Bay; south - west of Broadstairs and the North Foreland Light in KENT and certainly understood that the work of Joseph Conrad in south - east Asia was similar 'in tone and understanding' to that undertaken by Kaiser Whilhelm II; on board 'the SPHERE'; during the 'meetings at sea' in 1907; west of SIAM: between the Nicobar Islands and the Adamman Islands and ultimately off the coast of JAVA... -
Message 2
Posted by Vizzer aka U_numbers (U2011621) on Wednesday, 13th May 2009
It's unlikely that the Kaiser Wilhelm GeschΓΌtz survived the First World War. The reason being that it was advanced and powerful enough to have seen service in the Second World War but didn't.
The giant railway guns the Schwerer Gustav and the Dora which were built during the Second World War could fire larger missiles than Wilhelm but with a much shorter range.
Had Wilhelm still been around in 1939-45 then it's almost certain that the Germans would have brought it into service. -
Message 3
Posted by suvorovetz (U12273591) on Friday, 15th May 2009
Had Wilhelm still been around in 1939-45 then it's almost certain that the Germans would have brought it into serviceΒ If I'm not mistaken they actually dragged a 520mm French Howitzer to Leningrad during the infamous siege. By some accounts it was certainly as fascinating as it was useless. The industrial targets in the city were out of range for the most part. When fired upon defensive positions around the city, shells would hit the swampy soil and sink deep before exploding. Not too much bang for the buck, you could say.
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Message 4
Posted by David James Wall (U14752090) on Monday, 14th November 2011
Monday 14th November, 2011. GMT:1004
Re: 'Paris Gun'
With respect to all concerned; there is a foot - note which could be added to the above 'weird Detail'. That is; in 1897 a Javanese dance troupe visited 'stourton tower' in Kent and in front of an invited audience including Thomas Hardy and Joseph Conrad (the noted writers), performed a series of dance steps on what was described as a 'barrel fan'. The troupe consisted of 5 (five) female dancers; who were identical sisters: inotherwords a set of QUINS. The dance troupe were seen in verious places around the Island of Great Britain over the next five years and one of them was painted by the husband of the noted artist Dame Lora Knight. I note this because the so called SPY or 'espionage agent'; MATA HARI based part of her infamous dance routine on personal recollections of this Javanese dance troupe from 1902. Her later escapades; whether true or false did include a note made on the 'frequency' and 'accuracy' of the so called 'Paris Gun' in 1917. She called these despatches 'a note to those who srive to END TIME...' -
Message 5
Posted by Sambista (U4068266) on Monday, 14th November 2011
whether true or false did include a note made on the 'frequency' and 'accuracy' of the so called 'Paris Gun' in 1917. She called these despatches 'a note to those who srive to END TIME...'Β
Clever woman! To anticipate these factors (Paris gun didn't open fire till March 1918, she was executed in October 1917) -
Message 6
Posted by Raph33inUK (U14994758) on Monday, 14th November 2011
The problem with these guns was that, after a short number of shots, the tubes became unusable so, once it had fired its quota, the gun was out of order.
So this is no surprise they weren't re-used in WWII ... -
Message 7
Posted by Mutatis_Mutandis (U8620894) on Monday, 14th November 2011
To "not come down" the shell would have needed an upper atmosphere velocity of 11,000 m/s, and a muzzle velocity well above that. Impressive as the Paris gun was, it fell short of these requirements by about 90%.
Verne's inventive journey to the moon relied on a gun 900 feet long, weighing 64,000 tons, for those who have forgotten it
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Message 8
Posted by David James Wall (U14752090) on Tuesday, 15th November 2011
Tuesday 15th November, 2011. GMT:1132
Re: 'Paris Gun'
With respect to all concerned there were 4 (four) types of so called 'Paris Gun' which each shelled Paris, France during the later stages of the 1st World War.
The first to open fire; at dawn New Years Day, the 1st January, 1917 hit the CENTRAL AREA or Eyle otherwise known as the Elyses, with the deaths of 28 Deputies at a range of 128 miles: with pin point accuracy. The 'hot news' was published in the evening's two main newspapers and suppressed by SECURIT - E and 'State CONTROL' the morning afterwards.
With respect to the DEAD; the woman otherwise known as MATA HARI certainly supplied information on the H'' (hit) to a 'Swiss Contact' in the so called French 'CANTON of BERNE / SWITZERLAND' in the form of 'two rolled newspapers' (as described above): delivered by the 'surface post', the night of the engagement. Bizzarely as far as the history of MATA HARI is concerned; at her trial, the foundation of her defence was the fact that the information was in the 'public record' and delivered to 'a German contant' by 'natural and non - illicit means'. The defence very nearly worked to her advantage. What caught her out was her duplicity in 'ANDON perticuler'.
As far as March 1918 is concerned; the second of the four types of KRUPP designed and built 'Paris Gun' did open fire at the height of the 'St. Michael Offensive' within 'the bulge' or 'salient': with an estimated range of 76 miles. However its accuracy was questionable; it had a relatively flat trajectory and no - way matched the outstanding performance of KRUPP N1: built on the KOMMAND O/RE of Kaiser Wilhelm II himself as Ad IMP DIRECT TAYE / O/RE otherwise known as SUPREME LEADER WII (King of Germany). -
Message 9
Posted by Piltdown (U6504098) on Saturday, 3rd December 2011
The "Paris Gun" fired it's first round in action on 23rd March 1918, between then and July of that year the guns fired 303 shells, 183 of which hit Paris killing 256 and wounding 620.
Details are by no means complete but it seems that there were three operational mountings and seven barrels. One spare mounting was captured by American troops but nothing else was ever found and even the plans were destroyed. Due to the high muzzle velocity barrel wear was high and each shell was made slightly larger than the previous to compensate. Some reports claim that the second mounting was blown up when a shell was loaded out of sequence. Maximum altitude achieved was 40 km (c 25 miles) not nearly enough to put a shell into orbit.
Although it's psychological effect may have been greater than the physical damage (remember Paris was also bombed by Zeppelins and aeroplanes) the projectiles were tiny (210 lb) and it's doubtful if it ever justified the resources expended on it. By WW2 both the technology and the concept were well and truly obsolete.
The Paris Gun is often confused with Big Bertha and Gamma but these were completely different weapons.
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