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Engine Driver
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Message 1.Β
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Friday, 9th September 2005
My gggrandfather was an Engine Driver in Carlisle, he doesn't appear on any of the Census but his family does. I imagine he was away at these times of the census driving his trains. Are there places where Engine drivers may have stayed or would they just stay in some form of accomodation ?
As he doesn't appear on the Census i haven't much info on him.
Anybody clued up on Railway life ? -
Message 2
Posted by anisel (U1752839) on Friday, 9th September 2005
If you post his name, people here may be able to help you track him down.
Have you checked the Scottish censuses as well as the English ones? Carlisle is right on the border. -
Message 3
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Friday, 9th September 2005
I hadn't thought of that.
His name is John Pearson born c.1841 in Cumberland, possibly Carlisle. If someone could look him up on Scottish census. Unfortunately i'm at work and i can't view the census here.
He should be down as Engine Stoker/Driver.
Thanks in advance.
(i am on a break at work by the way) -
Message 4
Posted by Jowin1 (U1940449) ** on Friday, 9th September 2005
In the old BR Terms and conditions, if a driver drives to another depot, he can stay anywhere he likes and claim back the costs.
Jo -
Message 5
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Friday, 9th September 2005
If you post his name, people here may be able to help you track him down.
Have you checked the Scottish censuses as well as the English ones? Carlisle is right on the border.Β
I've now looked at the Scottish census 1871-1901 and there is no sign of him. Thanks for the idea anyway.
I've contacted the NRM to see if they have listings of Railway staff etc. -
Message 6
Posted by Linda1111 (U1103093) on Friday, 9th September 2005
Why are you confident that he would have been in Scotland? Could he have been in England? Just a thought, tell me if I am out of line!
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Message 7
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Friday, 9th September 2005
Why are you confident that he would have been in Scotland? Could he have been in England? Just a thought, tell me if I am out of line!Β
I'm not confident at all, i was just following a suggestion by Anisel that because he is not on the 1861-1901 Census for England and because Carlisle is on the border, he may have had accomodation in Scotland. Unfortunately he is nowhere to be seen, except probably on his train.
You are not out of line, thanks for the thought. -
Message 8
Posted by Jean (U1754038) on Friday, 9th September 2005
Hi, what were the names of the rest of his family you mentioned and which census have you found them?, hopefully this might narrow things down, best wishes, Jean
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Message 9
Posted by dmatt74 (U1690430) on Friday, 9th September 2005
You could try The National Archives, Kew, as well as The National Archives of Scotland for the railway company records, but you will need to know the company. There is a railway atlas (I think it is Jowitt's)which lists the railway companies with dates and maps. This was before the creation of the big four companies, London Midland and Scottish used Carlisle but some Cumbrian railways as well as Scottish border companies may also be in the area.
Technically the census was at Midnight so he could be en-route. Maybe the Cumbria archives office may have some information on train drivers. -
Message 10
Posted by reader (U1767310) on Saturday, 10th September 2005
Hi
This may sound silly but how sure are you that John Pearson drove trains?
I ask because my grandfather was a stationary engine stoker and I noticed on 1881 census a John Pearson 38 born Threkeld,Cumb an Engine Mder (Iron Ore Mine)boarding at 71 High Street, Cleator. -
Message 11
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Saturday, 10th September 2005
Hi
This may sound silly but how sure are you that John Pearson drove trains?
I ask because my grandfather was a stationary engine stoker and I noticed on 1881 census a John Pearson 38 born Threkeld,Cumb an Engine Mder (Iron Ore Mine)boarding at 71 High Street, Cleator.Β
Thought you might have been on to something there, i've just checked it out. It's not him as he was definitely married with children.
i've just looked again at his occup. and he's down as Engine Stoker/Driver and Railway Superintendent. Thanks for trying reader !!! -
Message 12
Posted by Alaric the Goth (U1826823) on Friday, 23rd September 2005
Re. the railway companies serving Carlisle at that time:
Up until 1st Jan. 1923:
London & North Western Railway (LNWR) by far the biggest. Route south to Lancaster, Preston, Birmingham & London. Shed at Carlisle Kingmoor.
Midland Railway (MR): also big, south to Leeds, Sheffield, East Midlands & London.
North Eastern Railway (NER): east to Newcastle.
Maryport & Carlisle Railway (MCR): little local company.
And three Scottish companies served the city:
Caledonian Railway (CR): main line to Glasgow and Edinburgh.
North British Railway (NBR): main line to Edinburgh through the Borders, local lines to Silloth and Port Carlisle.
Glasgow & South Western Railway (G&SWR): lines to Glasgow via Nithsdale, and Kilmarnock/Ayr.
From 1923 the CR, G&SWR, LNWR, MR and MCR became part of the London, Midland and Scottish Railway (LMS). The NER nad NBR became part of the London & North Eastern Railway (LNER).
Hope this helps!
Alaric the Railway Enthusiast. -
Message 13
Posted by Stepney Boy (U1760040) on Friday, 23rd September 2005
Hi Halcroves,<BR /> On the 1871 census is the following family living at 2, Forsters Close, Caldewgate, Carlisle, Cumberland.<BR /><BR />John Pearson Head, born 1841 Penrith, Cumberland.<BR />Occupation. Cotton Power room Overlooker.<BR />(Steam Driven?)<BR />Margaret, Wife, born 1841 Carlisle.<BR /><BR />May J, daughter, born 1862 Carlisle.<BR /><BR />Thomas, son, born 1869 Carlisle.<BR /><BR />Robert, son, born 1870 Carlisle.<BR /><BR />Source Info. RG10/5221<BR />Reg. Dist. Carlisle<BR />Folio 106. Page 33.<BR /><BR />On the 1881 census they are living at 2, Margaret Street, St. Cuthbert W/O Butchergate, Cunbria.<BR /><BR />They have an additional daughter Fanny born 1874 in Carlise.<BR /><BR />However Margaret the wife is shown as a WIDOW and her occupation is given as a power loom cotton weaver.<BR /><BR />Source info. RG11/5155.<BR />Reg. Dist. Carlisle.<BR />Folio 136. Page 24.<BR /><BR />Hope this is the right family as it could explain his none appearence on other censuses.<BR /><BR />Regards<BR />Spike<BR /><BR /><QUOTE' USER='halcroves' USERID='1813496'>I hadn't thought of that.<BR />His name is John Pearson born c.1841 in Cumberland, possibly Carlisle. If someone could look him up on Scottish census. Unfortunately i'm at work and i can't view the census here.<BR />He should be down as Engine Stoker/Driver.<BR /><BR />Thanks in advance.<BR /><BR />(i am on a break at work by the way)</QUOTE>
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Message 14
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Friday, 23rd September 2005
Firstly thank you Alaric for the railway info, the Shed at Kingmoor sounds very promising !!
Spike thanks for your time on this one, unfortunately its not the right family. His family are all from and living in Kingstown (Kingmoor) Carlisle.
His wife is Margaret Pearson (nee Graham) b.1843 and she is living at Kingstown Carlisle with her Father George and her children.
On the 1891 the family are at 'The Jovial Butcher Inn' in Kingstown still living with her Father and showing as Married.
On the 1901 she is Innkeeper of the 'Kings Arms 'in Kingstown.
His family is clearly there and she is still married with his children.
No sign of John Pearson !!!
Thanks again for the replies.
Hal. -
Message 15
Posted by Alaric the Goth (U1826823) on Friday, 30th September 2005
Er, confession! I was somewhat inaccurate!
I just checked out Carlisle Kingmoor on the 'net, and it was the Caledonian Railway's shed, not the LNWR's like I said. It and Canal shed (that belonged to the North British Railway) were the two Carlisle locomotive depots to the north of Citadel Station (as you might expect, as these were both Scottish comnpanies).
Sorry! -
Message 16
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Friday, 30th September 2005
Thanks for that Mr Alaric (Railway man !!)
I've been focusing my time again this week on obtaining John Pearson's birth cert and its proving a real struggle.
As i don't know where he was born (ie. not on any Census) its very tricky. Cockermouth RO have found two potential entries but the Father's occupation doesn't quite match and i'm wondering if the Father changed occupations ? i'm awaiting one other possible entry from Carlisle and then i think thats it. i'll have to try and locate his work place/staff records.
It can send you 'off the rails' (if you pardon the pun) this family history business.
Thanks again
Hal -
Message 17
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Thursday, 6th October 2005
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Message 18
Posted by Linda1111 (U1103093) on Thursday, 6th October 2005
Oh dear Hal...wrong certificate?
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Message 19
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Thursday, 6th October 2005
i'm afraid so !!
Back to the drawing board !! -
Message 20
Posted by halcroves (U1813496) on Thursday, 6th October 2005
Oh dear Hal...wrong certificate?Β
Isi, I'm on to something !!!
This time next week i think i'll have John Pearson nailed !!!
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