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The Hay Family
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Message 1.Β
Posted by EquilibriumYaw (U15039604) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
I am new to this game, so any help from any experienced "Messageboarder(s)" on the following person(s) would help me scale the brick wall that I am facing on my family tree.
Can anyone please provide more information on my Great(3)grandfather/grandmother:
Thomas William Henry Hay and Agnes Duncan.
They were married at All Saints Church, Newcastle-upon-Tyne on 10.06.1806.
Many thanks in anticipation,
bg -
Message 2
Posted by Pheno (U14601115) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
Hi, could these perhaps be relevant entries?
William Hay
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 06 Mar 1796 Jarrow,​ Durham,​ England
residence: Heworth,​ Durham,​ England
parents: Robert Hay
Agness Duncan
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 11 Mar 1792 SAINT NICHOLAS PARISH REG AND NONCONF ,​ NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE,​ NORTHUMBERLAND,​ ENGLAND
residence: Northumberland,​ England
parents: William Duncan,​ Isabell
Pheno -
Message 3
Posted by EquilibriumYaw (U15039604) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
Hi Pheno,
many,many thanks for your quick responce - I have printed out the details that you posted but need to carry out further checks (compering dates and places etc) before I can add them to my family tree.
Question: can you please confirm that his other christian names were: Thomas and Henry?
best wishes
bg -
Message 4
Posted by Pheno (U14601115) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
No sorry, these are familysearch results and no further data is given.
Pheno -
Message 5
Posted by Tourmie (U13798934) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
Might this be him in 1841? Possiby with a second wife and family if so. This William is a fisherman.
William Hay
45
Ann Hay
30
Ann Hay
6
George Hay
4
Mary Hay
2
James Hay
10 MO -
Message 6
Posted by writerlucy24 (U13905009) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
Hi,
From personal experienceI think this is the point where you will need to see the original records of the marriage ( and the banns) for more information. Records for the period you are looking at for All Saints, Newcastle upon Tyne are held by the Tyne & Wear Archives service in Newcastle.
I should mention that the family names Hay and Duncan were both quite common in the period you are looking at in the Newcastle area and are connected with families of both Scottish and Jamaican families, the latter as a result of the coffee trade.
Whilst a person at that time may have been given several forenames these did not often get used in the course of that persons business or occupation. For example there is a boot and shoemaker called Thomas Hay listed in the business directory for Gateshead for 1811.
Lucy -
Message 7
Posted by EquilibriumYaw (U15039604) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
Hi Lucy,
many thanks for your reply and the information given - I too suspected that Agnes Duncan originally came from Scotland.
The listing of a Thomas Hay in the business directory for Gateshead in 1811 is also a good lead.
bg -
Message 8
Posted by EquilibriumYaw (U15039604) on Sunday, 20th November 2011
Hi Tourmie,
many thanks for your reply - the second wife theory is also very interesting.
bg -
Message 9
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
I would suggest you trawl through the Bishops Transcript images on Family search. Northumberland (incl Newcastle) have sneaked in the Durham transcripts.
What else do you know about Thomas Hay and Agnes Duncan? number of chidlren? abode? occupation etc? if you find his death entry it will give you his age and something else to go on
Really spooky, I've also been searching for my Duncan ancestors from Durham this morning! Mine came from Monaghan Ireland. -
Message 10
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
Thomas W H Hay may not have even been born in the area, many military marriages took place at all saints from soldiers based at the garrison in newcastle.
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Message 11
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
ok....
this baptism will help you! you can download the image from family search
Click on Europe> England then scroll down to Englad, diocese of Durham Bishops transcripts> Northumberland > Newcastle upon tyne > 1799-1815 Newcastle upon tyne All Saints
there are 857 pages to these records. go to page 451!
John Duncan Hay
born Aug 24 baptised Jan 1 1808
1st son o f Thomas William Henry Hay, joiner, of EAST INDIES! by his wife Agnes, daughter of John Duncan, mason of Aberdeen Scotland
If you keep trawling through, you might come across a burial for Thomas or Agnes to help narrow down their ages. -
Message 12
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
image for siblings 681/857
Name: Mrgt Hay
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 20 Jul 1812
Baptism/Christening Place: ALL SAINTS,NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE,NORTHUMBERLAND,ENGLAND
Birth Date: 01 Jun 1812
Father's Name: Tho Wm Hy Hay
Mother's Name: Agnes Donkin
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00429-2
System Origin: England-ODM
Source Film Number: 95009
Reference Number:
Name: Sarah Hay
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 20 Jul 1812
Baptism/Christening Place: ALL SAINTS,NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE,NORTHUMBERLAND,ENGLAND
Birth Date: 01 Mar 1810
Father's Name: Tho Wm Hy Hay
Mother's Name: Agnes Donkin
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00429-2
System Origin: England-ODM
Source Film Number: 95009
on the next database 1815-1823.....
image 10/699
address is given as Sandgate
Name: Agnes Hay
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 09 Jul 1815
Baptism/Christening Place: ALL SAINTS, NEWCASTLE-UPON-TYNE, NORTHUMBERLAND, ENGLAND
Father's Name: Thomas William Henry Hay
Mother's Name: Agnes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C02369-7
System Origin: England-EASy
Source Film Number: 1068962
Reference Number: item 3 p 134
image 238
Still living at Sandgate. Thomas is down as a cabinet maker
Name: Thomas Hay
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 11 Jan 1818
Baptism/Christening Place: ALL SAINTS, NEWCASTLE-UPON-TYNE, NORTHUMBERLAND, ENGLAND
Father's Name: Thomas Hay
Mother's Name: Agnes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C02369-7
System Origin: England-EASy
Source Film Number: 1068962
Reference Number: item 3 p 297
they either move from the area after that or look for deaths after July 1818 image 238 -
Message 13
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
a tree on ancestry has Thomas William Henry Hay 1788-1841
and Agnes Duncan 1774-1838?
there are quite a few trees with them in -
Message 14
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
ah...
seems they go back to Bengal India in 1819!
death 12 mar 1841 Cawnpaw India
hmmmm... I suspect you already knew the india connection though as all the children marry and die there! It does help to say as I wouldn't have spent HOURS trawling images
I suggest you go to the India Room at the British library for further investigation -
Message 15
Posted by EquilibriumYaw (U15039604) on Monday, 21st November 2011
Hi jc,
many thanks for all the info concerning Thomas William Henry Hay that you provided - that should keep me busy for a while.
I do have the names of his children:
John Duncan Hay, b. 12.10.1807, Newcastle-upon-Tyne, christend 01.01.1808 at All Saints, Newcastle-upon-Tyne
he married Isabella Jane Duncan on 25.03.1845 in Cawnpore, India.
Isabella's (also spelt with a z ) father was Allan Duncan.
Sarah Hay, b. 01.03.1810, Durham, Christend 20.07.1812 at All Saints, Newcastle.
Agnes Hay, DOB not known, however, Christend on 09.07.1815 at All Saints, Newcastle
Margaret Hay, b. 01.06.1812, Hebburn, Durham, Christend on 20.07.1812, she married John Renwick on 10.07.1843 in Newcastle-upon-Tyne.
It would be great if I could find the parents of Thomas William Henry Hay!!!!!!!!!!!
Incidently, John Duncan Hay was listed as "Captain Veteran's Establishment" in India.
However, I have not established what the Veterans Establishment was in India - sounds a bit like "Dad'd Army!!!!!!!!!
There is also a distinct possibility that the Hay Family were relatives of the Duncan family -
(but this is still to be confirmed)
bg -
Message 16
Posted by clematised (U3233879) on Monday, 21st November 2011
You can join the India List at rootsweb and ask about him there as many knowledgable people will help with questions about his time in Inda, FIBIS also a good site for information on India.
Edna -
Message 17
Posted by clematised (U3233879) on Monday, 21st November 2011
Familysearch for India
Edna -
Message 18
Posted by jc (U1902680) on Monday, 21st November 2011
yes I read the sad demise of John Duncan Hay's family in India...., looks like he married a cousin
You will need to do a search on Scotlands people for Agnes Duncan with Father John mason in Aberdeen. You need to purchase credits though... I don't have any -
Message 19
Posted by EquilibriumYaw (U15039604) on Monday, 21st November 2011
Hi jc,
thanks once again for your input and my apologises if I have caused you uncessary work - I was aware of the India connection but only for John Duncan Hay. I was not aware that the other children married and died there.
As I now have sufficient information to continue with my family tree research, may I ask you to cease trawling further images on my behalf.
I am very greatful to both you and all the other "messageboarders" who kindly took time out to help with my initial request.
Regards,
bg
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