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James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 1.Μύ
Posted by David James Wall (U14752090) on Monday, 14th November 2011
Monday 14th November, 2011. GMT:1251
Re: SIS / MI6
With respect to all concerned; I remain a little bewildered by the character exhibited by James BOND: SIS / MI6. Some would take him to be Military Intelligence; others Naval Intelligence. Some; an Officer in a Line Regiment: others a Royal Marine Commando. Some an Officer attached to the Special Air Service Regiment; others a Royal Marine attached to 30 Commando: perhaps even 30AU (30 Assault Unit) historically.
What remains perhaps most perplexing when the true history of SIS / MI6 is written with regards to the '2nd World War' and indeed the COLD WAR is that real knowledge of the 'enemies of the STATE' usually begins in childhood...
Dear Mr Bond. What was your childhood really all about?Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 2
Posted by raundsgirl (U2992430) on Monday, 14th November 2011
David, I want to break this to you gently, but actually "James Bond" is a fictional character.
Do please try to restrict the use of block capitals, they make your posts so terribly tedious to read!Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 3
Posted by CASSEROLEON (U11049737) on Monday, 14th November 2011
As I understand that Bond is based upon Fleming's work for British intelligence I would imagine that- rather like the novels of that other wartime Civil Servant Iris Murdock- to some extent they are based upon a deliberately fictionalised universe that- like the works of that other Oxford Don "Lewis Carol"- is a version of truth either through the looking glass, or wonderland or even distorting mirrors.
CassLink to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 4
Posted by Nielsen3 (U14417619) on Monday, 14th November 2011
David,
Further on what raundsgirl and Casseroleon so excelently wrote, and regarding your own sentence '... What remains perhaps most perplexing when the true history of SIS / MI6 is written ...'
What, please, gives or gave you the idea that anysuch story will ever be written, much less published?
Such organisations lives much better in darkness - sub rosa - covered in all kinds of myths, fables, and semi-religious babble, where everybody outside are allowed their own pet theories, which never will be verified nor denied, and the only comment that may be seen will be along the lines of, '... it's not the policy of this, if it exists, or any other such government agency to comment publicly on either its personel or any occurrences that may or may not have happened ...'Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 5
Posted by dmatt47 (U13073434) on Monday, 14th November 2011
Monday 14th November, 2011. GMT:1251
Re: SIS / MI6
With respect to all concerned; I remain a little bewildered by the character exhibited by James BOND: SIS / MI6. Some would take him to be Military Intelligence; others Naval Intelligence. Some; an Officer in a Line Regiment: others a Royal Marine Commando. Some an Officer attached to the Special Air Service Regiment; others a Royal Marine attached to 30 Commando: perhaps even 30AU (30 Assault Unit) historically.
What remains perhaps most perplexing when the true history of SIS / MI6 is written with regards to the '2nd World War' and indeed the COLD WAR is that real knowledge of the 'enemies of the STATE' usually begins in childhood...
Dear Mr Bond. What was your childhood really all about?
Μύ Fleming was of course in Navai Intelligence and used to sign his letters with the letter 'F' . There is an official history of SIS/MI6 during the Second World War but stops before the start of the Cold War.Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 6
Posted by Herewordless (U14549396) on Tuesday, 15th November 2011
The character of Bond was half-Scottish, half-Swiss.
Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 7
Posted by David James Wall (U14752090) on Tuesday, 15th November 2011
Tuesday 15th November, 2011. GMT:1030
Re: James BOND: SIS / MI6
With respect to all concerned; I am fully aware that James Bond is a character created by the writer Ian Fleming. I am also aware that Ian Fleming was a member of the Royal Navy during the 2nd World War.
The 'weird Detail' is that my father; Harold John Wall (30th october, 1923 - 25th September, 1971) was a Royal Marine Commando (enlisted Bonhill, Scotland / 18th January, 1945). He was a Staff S. (equivalent RANK) SIGNAL detail, seconded to 457 Signal Security Section; NSD (Naval Signals Division): D.NI (Directorate. Naval Intelligence) and formally attached to 30AU (30 Assault Unit) prior to the crossing of the Rhine in March, 1945. His formal 'Command and Control' was Lord HARWOOD. OC. 1st COMMANDO BRIGADE. 'Inter alia' my father worked 'for / with' Captain FLEMING RN. / NID (Naval Intelligence Department). OC. 30 COMMANDO / 30AU (Assault Unit). Otherwise known as the writer Ian Fleming.
My question, albeit in 'arse and henry perticular' is based upon an observation made by my father. Captain FLEMING RN. albeit a member of so called 'Naval Intelligence' was refused access to 'British Military Intelligence' including the 'backfile' MI6 DETAIL. Ian Fleming as far as I am led to believe was not, repeat not MI6. He never recovered from the reverse and to all intents retired from 'security and Intelligence matters' on the 31st December, 1947.Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 8
Posted by CASSEROLEON (U11049737) on Tuesday, 15th November 2011
David James Wall
I understood that one of the MB rules was that we should not reveal details that could identify us personally..
But if Fleming was disappointed in not having a post-war carreer in intelligence, that surely was an experience that was shared by vast numbers of people (including many of the women who had worked on the Βι¶ΉΤΌΕΔ Front and who were sent back to their housewifely duties so that the ex-servicemen could have jobs).. It would appear that the scaling down of Britain's current military deployments will produce similar disappointments.
It seems to me that Fleming- like most of those people (including Iris Murdock) managed to draw upon his knowledge and experience to become a successful novelist. Does this qualify as "never getting over it"?
Surely "what might have been" both individually and collectively is a shadow that looks over the shoulder of us all. And we all have to get on with the life choices that are still there in the present.
Going back to your OP.. Did your father feel that he, or people that he also knew, were "grist to the mill" when Fleming came to "inventing" characters for the Bond novels?
CassLink to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 9
Posted by marchog_du_aka_Stoggler (U14998493) on Tuesday, 15th November 2011
What on earth possessed you David to put your father's personal details such as full name, dates of birth and death? Why do you think that's relevant?
Essentially, the paragraph
The 'weird Detail' is that my father; Harold John Wall (30th october, 1923 - 25th September, 1971) was a Royal Marine Commando (enlisted Bonhill, Scotland / 18th January, 1945). He was a Staff S. (equivalent RANK) SIGNAL detail, seconded to 457 Signal Security Section; NSD (Naval Signals Division): D.NI (Directorate. Naval Intelligence) and formally attached to 30AU (30 Assault Unit) prior to the crossing of the Rhine in March, 1945. His formal 'Command and Control' was Lord HARWOOD. OC. 1st COMMANDO BRIGADE. 'Inter alia' my father worked 'for / with' Captain FLEMING RN. / NID (Naval Intelligence Department). OC. 30 COMMANDO / 30AU (Assault Unit). Otherwise known as the writer Ian Fleming. Μύ
can be condensed to "my father worked for/with Ian Fleming in the war"...!
I notice you still can't resist that bizarre "With respect to all concerned" and all the capitalisations. As I asked you in a previous thread (which you ignored), were you taught to write letters, essays and other written pieces like that at school? Really, I am rather curious.Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 10
Posted by David James Wall (U14752090) on Wednesday, 16th November 2011
Wednesday 16th November, 2011. GMT:1341
Re: Harold John Wall
With respect to those who have read and enjoyed the 'James BOND' movies, let alone the novels themselves; I can't confirm whether my father was a character model except in one regard: on the 28th of April (Adolf Hitler's Birthday bizzarely enough), 1945 my father RMC (Combined Operations) Staff. S / WALL: 457 SSS / NSD / D.NI was captured outside CHEMENTNZ / REICH by the WAFFEN SS. He was transported to 'RAVENSBURGH Concentration Camp' and 'interviewed' by the so called GESTAPO; 'under tension'. After 'formal interview' he was 'noted' under the so called COMMANDO ORDER; a 'brigand'. The 'execution order' was wired to the Reich Chancellory for 'triple order demarcation' that night but Adolf Hitler was already dead. The TZZ O/RE was never 'signed and sealed' and thus my father was still alive when Ravensburgh or rather 'Ravenbroch' was liberated on the 9th May, 1945 by forward elements of 'SOE transport DETAIL'. Intriguingly Harry (my father) was actually released by my mother; his future wife: Doreen Mary Sellers / FRENCH Section SOE / MI9 (escape and evasion). For the record Ian Fleming (the writer) read the file regarding my fathers torture. Intrigingly he never lived to understand that my mother was otherwise known by the codename REBECCA: SIS / MI6. Her ANDON was 'REICH Chancellory Secatariate'. For the record my mother made it all the way to 'voss Strasser' and 'home again'.Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 11
Posted by hereisabee (U2342191) on Wednesday, 16th November 2011
Gosh, you have most interesting parents. I tried to get a Bond thread going a year or so ago but it was rejected. That was because I had been in Dorset and had been listening to the many accounts of Fleming who went to prep school at Langton Matravers near Swanage. The name Bond was local to the Isle of Purbeck and went back to a John Bond, an Elizabethan and possible spy for Walsingham. Walsingham kept codes for all his agents and 007 was the code for Sir John Dee (the Magician) who was also admired by Elias Ashmole. Did your fathers name come up in any of the books, Fleming was not very creative and borrowed names such as Goldfinger which was not appreciated?
See 1588
The village of Tyneham was evacuated for military pupuses in WW2Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 12
Posted by raundsgirl (U2992430) on Wednesday, 16th November 2011
David, short of your address and telephone number, you have given us an alarming number of personal details, in spite of people kindly advising you not to. Don't you understand that anyone can see these messages, you can even get them on Google! That means any nasty little fraudster can steal your identity
What's one of the most common security questions? "Mother's name" You've just made us a present of that. Do have a bit of sense!Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 13
Posted by CASSEROLEON (U11049737) on Wednesday, 16th November 2011
raundsgirl
One might even conclude that risk-taking is in the genes.
CassLink to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 14
Posted by Meles meles (U14993979) on Thursday, 17th November 2011
....... "I can't confirm whether my father was a character model except in one regard: on the 28th of April (Adolf Hitler's Birthday bizzarely enough), 1945".....
not that bizarre really and not even a coincidence
Hilter's birthday was 20 April!
bizarrely EXACTLTY a full ONE week and ONE day earlier.
Have have to say, with (very little) respect, David, you do write the most absolute tripe!Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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Message 15
Posted by David James Wall (U14752090) on Monday, 21st November 2011
Monday 21st November, 2011. GMT:1318
Re: Ian Fleming
With respect to all concerned; there is a point which I would like discussed by those 'elders and betters' who may have lived the preriod of Ian Fleming's wartime service.
The question surrounds the fact that a certain Ian Fleming ( later the writer of James BOND) was photographed in the uniform of the so called 'wavy NAVY' or RNVR (Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve) in Room 39 of the Admiralty Building. He posed in front of the main fireplace and mantlepiece above which there was a 'station - clock' set at an 'off - hour'...
The weird detail is that my father; Harold John Wall once told me in private as a child that the RNVR were RVO (Royal Victorian Order); members of the Royal Family and in contemporary terms 'Civil List'. In the photograph, Ian Fleming appears to be a very, very young 'Commander RNVR'. Most people (such as my father) took him to be Captain FLEMING RN and at the time the photograph was taken; as reference for 'US Naval Intelligence': looked a mite 'spooked'...Link to this forum: James BOND: SIS / MI6. Who do you really think you are?
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