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Alison Weir
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Message 1.Μύ
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Monday, 24th October 2011
Never read any of her stuff myself, but I know Alison Weir has quite a following amongst the less hysterical female members of this board, so I thought I'd alert posters to her slot at the forthcoming Institute for Historical Research conference on academic history and historical fiction...
Friday, 18 November
10.00 Registration
10.25 Introduction
10.30 Plenary
Alison Weir (author and historian)
WMUAWHG!
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Message 2
Posted by somewhatsilly (U14315357) on Monday, 24th October 2011
Not really my area of interest either but I looked up the event and the programme does look interesting and touches on many of the issues that are discussed on this board, this in particular, 'The differences and similarities between historical fiction and academic history'!
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Message 3
Posted by Temperance (U14455940) on Monday, 24th October 2011
Oh, joy.
Thank you for the info, Catty and ferval.
An hysterical,
SST. -
Message 4
Posted by Gran (U14388334) on Monday, 24th October 2011
How fascinating, I do hope someone who goes along will enlighten us expats on what will be a very interesting lecture.
Hopefully
Gran -
Message 5
Posted by Caro (U1691443) on Tuesday, 25th October 2011
I have only read Alison Weir's Eleanor of Aquitaine, which wasn't fiction, and I own her book delineating the family trees of the Royal Family over the centuries. There are, I think, a few errors in this, but since I manage to make mistakes in short articles for the newspaper I am not as damning about this as others.
That does sound an interesting set of talks. I read historical fiction, though it's often set in New Zealand, or is relatively literary. But I have read all of Edward Rutherfurd's books apart from Dublin which was in two volumes and since I know no Irish history to speak of, it was rather daunting, and also slightly mystical in the beginning part, so I gave it up.
Inaccuracies in these fictional accounts don't bother me too much, since I am unlikely to retain the information anyway if I don't already know it, and if I do it doesn't matter. But they tend to give a flavour of the times, and help put historical figures in their time frame. It is easy if, like me, your history study was geared to English history, not to be quite aware of just how intertwined it was with French, Scottish, Dutch, Prussian etc people and I find these fictional accounts often connect these in ways a concentration on English/British constitutional history didn't.
And then, of course, some of them are just fun to read as romances. (The Other Boleyn Girl for instance, though it was fortunate that people were telling me at the same time that this wasn't a realistic portrayal of the two sisters.)
I don think, though if people have deliberately twisted history or used fictional and non-fictional characters, that this should be made clear to the reader. I was a little distressed when reading a child's book taking the story of Macbeth further on that the author gave timelines based on Shakespeare's ideas - showing Macbeth had only reigned for one year, etc. She did make a bit of a disclaimer, but it wasn't much, and I think kids wouldn't necessarily have the information to know it wasn't right.
Cheers, Caro. -
Message 6
Posted by Minette Minor (U14272111) on Thursday, 27th October 2011
Facts play little part in popular (and unpopular come to that) History today Caro! Just make it up as you go along, spin a good yarn then head for the bank when Hollywood comes calling! Cheers, Minette.
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Message 7
Posted by marchog_du_aka_Stoggler (U14998493) on Thursday, 27th October 2011
Facts play little part in popular (and unpopular come to that) History today Caro! Just make it up as you go along, spin a good yarn then head for the bank when Hollywood comes calling! Cheers, Minette.
Μύ
That's hardly a phenomenon confined to modern times! -
Message 8
Posted by Lyra (U2293272) on Friday, 28th October 2011
It looks fascinating, thanks very much for the link, although I'm very unlikely to get there (shame). I would particularly like to hear Hilary Mantel. "A Place of Greater Safety" is one my favourite historical novels.
I read historical fiction, but I tend to steer clear of the period I studied. I find Alison Weir entertaining and not too bad for accuracy (as far as I can tell). I can ignore a few slips if the story telling is good. I also enjoyed "The Other Boleyn Girl", although I was aware that it probably bore about as much resemblance reality as "The Tudors"! I don't care for many of Phillipa Gregory's other books though. I tried "The White Queen" and I thought that it was sloppy writing and had the feel of a rush job. I also enjoy Sharon Penman's books, although i get the impression she's fallen a little out of fashion at the moment.
I think that the trade off between historical accuracy and what makes good fiction is a difficult one for the novelist. After all, it's rare that our knowledge of a period is 100% so the novelist is always going to have to make choices and fill in the gaps. I suppose it's how far to go in filling in the gaps that is the difficult choice. -
Message 9
Posted by an ex-nordmann - it has ceased to exist (U3472955) on Friday, 28th October 2011
I agree with you, Lyra.
To me there are two ways in which a writer of historical fiction can be considered "successful". One is when the writer, in attempting to invent a fact, researches his or her subject to the point where at least the ensuing invention can be said to have at least been a plausible occurrence. The other method is to avoid fact altogether and attempt to place the narrative against a vague backdrop of historical events without making any specific claims concerning those events.
"Unsuccessful" (and often to the point of cringeworthiness) is when the author places the narrative slap bang amidst important historical players and events where even the most rudimentary research would have sufficed to avoid implausible claims related to these people and events within the story. It is "bad" history and, on that very important basis, therefore devalued as an historical narrative - even a fictional one - as the imperative that the reader suspends their disbelief has been irreversibly compromised. What is really galling is when writers who adopt this approach then defend their "style" using a false argument from authority (I know more, I spent years reading about this, blah blah), an equally false justificatiojn based on sales (I sold x number of copies of my book so my ignorance is vindicated by that of the readers), or simply the amazing denial by a so-called historical author that history matters (It's only fiction after all, The real story was too dull, I don't care - please change the subject).
Arrogant tosh - engaged in by some rather surprisingly popular exponents of the trade. -
Message 10
Posted by Minette Minor (U14272111) on Friday, 28th October 2011
Are you speaking of, "The Red and White Queens" soon to be followed by "The White Princess" by Philippa Gregory!? Surely not! I must read her just to know what is being written but it hurts. I've even, accidentally come across her on "I player" sitting on grass by a ruined something or other but was afraid to watch. Yet I'm curious to know if she will use a silly voice to be Margaret Beuafort. Surely she is making fun!? Please! Who can take this seriously?
As for Alison Weir.................The rest is silence. -
Message 11
Posted by Minette Minor (U14272111) on Friday, 28th October 2011
I've just thought. What about "The Pink Prince" followed by "A Blue Nun", "A Beige Lady" and, "A slightly Off White Knight". Such fun and I could become RICH! Throw in a vague historical story line with heaving loins and manly bosoms and the rest is ...History! Hollywood here I come!
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Message 12
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Saturday, 29th October 2011
In case anyone was wondering, 'WMUAWHG' in the OP stood for 'Wind Minette Up And Watch Her Go!'...
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Message 13
Posted by Caro (U1691443) on Saturday, 29th October 2011
Yes, it would be nice if fewer of your posts had that sub-text, Catigern.
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