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The Bayeux Tapestry
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Message 1.Â
Posted by Caro (U1691443) on Monday, 12th September 2011
On the talking book CD we listened to while travelling recently the narrator, travelling through France a little once-over-lightly for my husband’s taste, talked of going to see the Bayeux Tapestry in Normandy. She says she ‘expected it to be boring’, a statement which amazed me. Why would anyone expect it to be boring? What are you travelling round a country for if you expect the accounts of its history to be boring?
As it happened she found it quite fascinating – as I did when we visited, though unlike her I wasn’t surprised. The CD had quite a long section on the embroidery and its history and the vicissitudes it had been through in its time. I was specially interested in the near disasters that had befallen it when it might have been completely destroyed. The suggestion that it be cut up and the various parts used separately. Its travels during the war to protected areas. The time it was used to cover military weapons during the Napoleonic era. At times it was considered of little value.
We found the display of it very well done with good explanations both written and aural, though people are directed through in a way that means it is hard to go back or stay long at one area. And if you do, the aural talk is not in synch with what you are watching.
In a small South Island town in New Zealand, Geraldine, a man has spent more than 20 years reconstructing the tapestry using the steel bits from knitting machines. With his daughter’s help and with an obvious obsessive personality he has made it to go round the wall of a shop and had added two possible final panels. He has also made a CD which I have but haven’t watched which goes into all the history, the relationships, the genealogy of everyone, and which can pinpoint any small square and give the details of that particular weapon/person/animal/symbol etc. A stunning piece of work altogether. It’s not all that well known and not even advertised to any degree in the town it is in. But it’s one of the most amazing interior tourism sights we have seen.
Cheers, Caro. -
Message 2
Posted by somewhatsilly (U14315357) on Monday, 12th September 2011
Caro, I was intrigued by your description of New Zealand version but a mite confused by the 'bits of knitting machines', so I went looking and here it is
It's an astonishing piece of work but as you said, clearly the outcome of a personal obsession. I see it contains mathematical puzzles as well, its creator is obviously a genuine eccentric and there's not enough of those around. -
Message 3
Posted by RusEvo (U2126548) on Monday, 12th September 2011
Hi Caro,
Thanks for reminding me. I will make this a must do when I am over there!!
It is interesting how some objects manage to come through the ages. Your story of the Tapestry being used to cover some Napoleonic Weapons reminds me of the Parthenon being used to store Turkish armaments at one stage.
Rus. -
Message 4
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Monday, 12th September 2011
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Message 5
Posted by raundsgirl (U2992430) on Monday, 12th September 2011
"the Parthenon being used to store Turkish armaments at one stage."
Whilst people here and in Greece are carrying on in the "Give us back our Marbles" mode, let it not be forgotten that the above is the reason why Lord Elgin took the precious marble frieze away in the first place, and that by doing so he has also protected it from air pollution (and made it possible for many hundreds of visitors to view it more closely). -
Message 6
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Monday, 12th September 2011
If only the Brits who want to give the marbles to the Greeks
would concentrate their efforts on trying to have the Bayeux Tapestry brought over here!
I doubt it would ever occur to them, however, as they mostly seem to be of the pathetic, pinko, hand-wringing, self-loathing 'Britain was evil and now we must pay' sort...
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Message 7
Posted by islanddawn (U7379884) on Monday, 12th September 2011
let it not be forgotten that the above is the reason why Lord Elgin took the precious marble frieze away in the first place, and that by doing so he has also protected it from air pollution (and made it possible for many hundreds of visitors to view it more closely).Â
What, there has never been pollution in London then? And people never come to Athens either? Funny that the Acropolis and it's Museum was packed to the rafters when I was there this past week. But all that rubbish aside, Elgin's pilfering has also subjected the marbles to shipwreck and immersion in salt water for a period of time until recovery. The marbles have also been subjected to two or three disasterous cleaning attempts by the British Museum that have left irreparable damage.
It would so so refreshing and acceptable if some honesty was bought into the Elgin debate instead of the usual condescending and half baked self justifications. The only reasons the marbles are not handed back is because of the precident it would set to others wishing the return of national artifacts and the tourist dollars they bring into Britain. -
Message 8
Posted by raundsgirl (U2992430) on Monday, 12th September 2011
1. The marbles aren't kept outside
2. Only very wealthy British visited Athens at the time of Lord Elgin (which is the time I was talking about)
I think I shall retire to put on my full body armour and tin hat. -
Message 9
Posted by somewhatsilly (U14315357) on Monday, 12th September 2011
Coincidentally, there's a programme about the Elgin Marbles on Â鶹ԼÅÄ 4 at 11pm tonight.
Raunds, I think you're ascribing a degree of altruism to Lord E that may not be entirely justified, it's hard to think of a more impressive trophy to bring home. -
Message 10
Posted by raundsgirl (U2992430) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
Trophy or not, at least they weren't blown up by the Turks!
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Message 11
Posted by Jak (U1158529) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
at least they weren't blown up by the Turks!Â
- or ground up to make mortar.
Whether Lord Elgin "pilfered" the marbles, or "rescued" them, at least they still exist.
All this passion about where they are located today, and who should "own" them has always seemed a bit silly to me. Presumably it's the shape of the things that's important, and perfect copies could be made. Why is mere "ownership" seen to be so vital?
It sounds a bit like all that excitement about the Coronation Stone ("It's ours! We want it back!") So they bring it back from London to Scotland accompanied by flags and pipe bands - and who cares now? Who would pay £££ just to look at a boring lump of rock, because it's "ours"?
Another bit of excitement a few years ago about the medieval chessmen dug up somewhere in Scotland, but some of them were later sold to the British Museum. Cries of "Give us back oor wee men!" - pathetic. Almost as bad as that MSP who wanted the bones of Mary Q of S "brought home" (sic!) from Westminster Abbey.
I look forward to seeing the Bayeux Tapestry someday - in Bayeux. Or wherever. -
Message 12
Posted by islanddawn (U7379884) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
It wasn't the Turks who blew up the Acropolis, it was the Venetians in the 1687 Morean War. 200 yrs before Elgin and his light fingers happened along to inflict his very own version of damage to the site.
1. The marbles aren't kept outsideÂ
Neither are they in Athens, and haven't been outside for a long time.
2. Only very wealthy British visited Athens at the time of Lord Elgin (which is the time I was talking about)Â
Mmm, so it is permissable to take and keep the National Treasures of other countries just so the poorer British can have a chance to see them? Wonderful logic there.
I think I shall retire to put on my full body armour and tin hat.Â
Nah, it is just obvious that you have swallowed the asinine and easily refutable party line without too much thought or research. I also doubt that you realise how very superior and condescending it sounds to others. -
Message 13
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
I think we should encourage the Turks to reconquer Greece - in return for our support, they'd no doubt drop the olive-munching boy-buggerers' spurious claim to our marbles. Plus, let's face it, they couldn't possibly make a worse hash of running things than the locals have, to judge by the state of Greece at the moment...
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Message 14
Posted by islanddawn (U7379884) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
I know just how you feel Catigern.
The Bayeaux Tapestry is another example, even though it was probably made in England by English women and even though the English don't have much impressive stuff of their own to fill museums with, it is far safer in Normandy where they know how to clean and look after things properly. And, of course, all the French who can't afford to travel can get a look at it, they'll appreciate it more.
But then, the French do everything so much better. -
Message 15
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
...the English don't have much impressive stuff of their own to fill museums withÂ
We've got the Elgin marbles - they're our own, now, and have been for 200 years!
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Message 16
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
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Message 17
Posted by islanddawn (U7379884) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
We've got the Elgin marbles - they're our own, now, and have been for 200 years!Â
Ah you poor deprived thing, so happy to get your hands on someone else's hand me downs. And it doesn't even matter if they look silly where you put them, imagine that. -
Message 18
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
...so happy to get your hands on someone else's hand me downs.Â
I think that really ought to be addressed to modern Greeks, with regard to those who happened to live in the same part of the world thousands of years ago...
But, perhaps we first world nations should be more indulgent of developing countries' sensibilities... -
Message 19
Posted by somewhatsilly (U14315357) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
Who would pay £££ just to look at a boring lump of rock, because it's "ours"?Â
I quite agree Catigern. Why would anyone pay to see a 60 year old copy of a medieval cesspit cover? -
Message 20
Posted by islanddawn (U7379884) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
Is that all? But you've got to have something to brag about I suppose. You keep clinging to that.
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Message 21
Posted by islanddawn (U7379884) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
Ooops, sorry ferval. That was in reply to Catigern, who is obviously bored tonight.
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Message 22
Posted by Catigern (U14419012) on Tuesday, 13th September 2011
Is that all? But you've got to have something to brag about I suppose. You keep clinging to that. We also have decent, flushing toilets...
Keep biting that pillow, ID - he'll be finished soon...
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Message 23
Posted by silvery (U8422462) on Sunday, 18th September 2011
There is a replica of the Bayeux tapestry (embroidery) in Reading. You can look it up on the internet. Very interesting.
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